arm peace officers petition

[greylynx]

Originally Posted by HELL

Next theyl want cabbies bus drivers and commisionares carting guns spray and stun guns what's next

You would be surprised about the number of cabbies who pack guns.

Very scary.

[purgatory.sv]

Peace Officers can be armed at anytime if the solicitor general deems it.
When they came into existence their role was basic enforcement of bylaws.
So if the bureaucrats see value in certain situation they can be armed?
If that is the case training is to be provided.
It appears to be part of Alberta Government law.


Both sheriffs and peace officers’ are regulated by provincial laws.

[mark-edmonton]

Some peace officers are no more than glorified security guards. Not all mind you but many. Bylaw officers in my town are considered peace officer. No way in hell would I sign a petition to see some of those fat slobs carry a weapon. Some already exhibit inflamed egos due to the uniform! I know many security guards( peace officers) that work
Un hospitals I have worked with these men and women personally and call a few friend, yet u would still not put a gun in their hands. These words are only my opinion. You may feel different and that is cool too. Just my thoughts!!

[Big Daddy Badger]

Originally Posted by Kale_M

Community peace officer Level 1 training is 6 weeks. The exact same training as sheriffs only they do 9 weeks. They do alittle more on some legal stuff, emergency vehicle operator course (EVOC) and firearms. So they get a week of training to carry.

I worked with securicore before and I had 4 days of training and I could carry.

Big deal.
We have guys that train their whole adult lives with firearms and the ins and outs of when they can use them and they still aren't allowed to go around heeled in public...even if they have no rounds and are in uniform and on the job.

Maybe these guys are getting over tasked and that should be changed if it is the case but it'll be a cold day in hell before I support firearms for guys whose primary duty is to deliver paperwork and issue bylaw tickets when others aren't allowed to carry or shoot their in their own back 40.

Maybe if these guys could bring themselves to supporting owners instead of poaching their arguments I'd feel differently... but it seems a bit disingenuous to take the position that somehow a whole week of firearms training makes them more reliable than almost anyone else.

[Ebrand]

CPO 1 officers and sheriffs have identical requirements for employment and appointment as a peace officer. The requalification periods are identical. The only difference in the training is Emergency Vehicle Operators course that most municipalities train their cpos in and the firearm training.

Again thank you all who have chosen to sign.

[Big Daddy Badger]

Originally Posted by 260 Rem

School principals ...frequently deal with threatening parents ... undesirables tresspassing in school to sell drugs to kids. Hang on, been there - done that, but I didn't feel the need to pack a gun. One of my collegues, did keep a baseball bat handy

Don't forget hockey coaches and door to door salesmen.

[heretohunt]

I wonder if the same people who are opposed to peace officers carrying pistols are in support of a citizen's right to carry a pistol for personal protection. Be it for protection against bears or bad guys.
I'm not even sure that the level of training is an issue. What kind of training do you think that you need? Safe operation? We all have that course( those that take their pal). When to jerk that pistol and go to work? I'm sure that most of us could get that concept in an afternoon course. Some people on here think that physical fitness is a factor too?
I don't know much about peace officers but it seems like there are a bunch of people on here that their point is if "I can't carry one then why should they?"
The question that I'm thinking is the most important is how do we screen out the nut jobs or people with too short of tempers in any profession; school teachers, carpenters, peace officers, or police men or women etc.

[Blake]

Originally Posted by BeeGuy

What is the prerequisite? Highschool education? or is that not required?

Probably not as much education as an inflammatory arrogant entomologist/bug wrangler with a superiority complex (although I'm sure the stink bugs look at you as some sort of deity).

[Blake]

Originally Posted by greylynx

This dead guy

Classy

[270WIN]

[QUOTE=heretohunt;1565135
I don't know much about peace officers but it seems like there are a bunch of people on here that their point is if "I can't carry one then why should they?"
[/QUOTE]

Exactly, heretohunt. And when you think about it, it's pretty hard to argue against that line of reasoning.

[altaberg]

1369,

they should get what they need to defend themselves.
I know several and they run into dangerous situations, especially in small-town Alberta. Meth labs, druggies in parks, mentally unstable.

They should get the training and the means.

Some of your comments on here ("if I can't they shouldn't either") are very short-sighted.
More people carrying handguns for self-defence is a step in the right direction because it establihes in the pubic mind what handguns are: a tool for self-defence in the right hands.

[heretohunt]

Originally Posted by 270WIN

Exactly, heretohunt. And when you think about it, it's pretty hard to argue against that line of reasoning.

That is probably why you are the first to comment.

[blackpheasant]

Originally Posted by Okotokian

Recent issues apart, no way I want the ding-a-lings in Okotoks packing. Nobody I know in this town can stand them.

X2 Okie, some of the ones in Red Deer county watched "Smokey and the Bandit" one to many times I swear

[270WIN]

[QUOTE=heretohunt;1565135
The question that I'm thinking is the most important is how do we screen out the nut jobs or people with too short of tempers in any profession; school teachers, carpenters, peace officers, or police men or women etc.[/QUOTE]

By subjecting applicants for a CCW licence to a background check equivalent to the one applicants for admission into the RCMP must pass and then a firearms training program and examination process at least as (and preferably more) comprehensive and challenging as the one RCMP trainees are required to complete. Following successful completion of that, recertification at regular intervals - say every five years.
What would be wrong with that?

[Dr. Phil A]

I wouldn't give the Lacombe town toy cop a book of matches.....

[260 Rem]

Pesky --- absolutely right about the coaches...and the list goes on. Interesting how one death has ignited the cop wannabes to want to carry.

[Lone_Wolf]

Originally Posted by Kale_M

You guys that are against this have no clue what these officers do..

DING DING DING!

Absolutely 100% correct Kale. When I read these posts I am stunned by the lack of education and complete ignorance towards Peace Officers than anything else. Some of these posts are completely ridiculous! They are not wannabes, they are not mall cops, they are professional law enforcement officers who do a stellar job everyday to help keep Alberta safe.

SIGNED- #1375

[smithy]

Originally Posted by purgatory.sv

Peace Officers can be armed at anytime if the solicitor general deems it.

I just had a look at the Peace Officer Act as well as the Regulations. It does appear that this debate is, in fact, a moot point. The Act and Regs are clear that an "authorized employer" can make application to the Minister for the proposed peace officer to carry a weapon. Section 2(2) of the Regs state:

[B](2) If an applicant under subsection (1) proposes that a peace officer it employs or engages the services of carry and use a weapon, the applicant must provide reasons and evidence satisfactory to the Director that

(a) the employer has met the requirements of the Peace Officer Regulation,

(b) the peace officer has completed or will complete any training required by the Peace Officer Regulation or considered necessary by the Director, and

(c) the employer has policies and procedures satisfactory to the Director respecting the use, storage and maintenance of weapons as required by section 8 of the Peace Officer Regulation.[/B]

It appears that a petition is unecessary as the need for a weapon is dealt with on a case by case basis. Of interest, the Act does state that the "authorized employer" is liable for the acts or omissions of its peace officers.

[270WIN]

Originally Posted by heretohunt

That is probably why you are the first to comment.

I couldn't agree more. Nice to know we're all on the same page here.
Aren't we?

[NPO]

Originally Posted by pesky672

Don't forget hockey coaches and door to door salesmen.

There are Peace Officers in most post secondary high schools... and most high schools have a high school resource officer ( SRO ) So no need to worry about unauthorized kids selling drugs... Bottom line for those who have an opinion based on little to no fact... Walk in our shoes, and deal with the idiots we deal with... then tell me you wouldn't want to be armed.

Just as a side note... Sheriffs get 5 days training on the range... most of them work in the government buildings and court houses... and will never have to engage that weapon, why are their lives more important then ours? ( CPO )

[NPO]

Originally Posted by pesky672

Don't forget hockey coaches and door to door salesmen.

Originally Posted by smithy

I just had a look at the Peace Officer Act as well as the Regulations. It does appear that this debate is, in fact, a moot point. The Act and Regs are clear that an "authorized employer" can make application to the Minister for the proposed peace officer to carry a weapon. Section 2(2) of the Regs state:

[B](2) If an applicant under subsection (1) proposes that a peace officer it employs or engages the services of carry and use a weapon, the applicant must provide reasons and evidence satisfactory to the Director that

(a) the employer has met the requirements of the Peace Officer Regulation,

(b) the peace officer has completed or will complete any training required by the Peace Officer Regulation or considered necessary by the Director, and

(c) the employer has policies and procedures satisfactory to the Director respecting the use, storage and maintenance of weapons as required by section 8 of the Peace Officer Regulation.[/B]

It appears that a petition is unecessary as the need for a weapon is dealt with on a case by case basis. Of interest, the Act does state that the "authorized employer" is liable for the acts or omissions of its peace officers.

You have to look further... only OC and extendable batons are authorized weapons. AHS is no equipped with OC. Look at the act closer

[NPO]

Originally Posted by pesky672

Big deal.
We have guys that train their whole adult lives with firearms and the ins and outs of when they can use them and they still aren't allowed to go around heeled in public...even if they have no rounds and are in uniform and on the job.

Maybe these guys are getting over tasked and that should be changed if it is the case but it'll be a cold day in hell before I support firearms for guys whose primary duty is to deliver paperwork and issue bylaw tickets when others aren't allowed to carry or shoot their in their own back 40.

Maybe if these guys could bring themselves to supporting owners instead of poaching their arguments I'd feel differently... but it seems a bit disingenuous to take the position that somehow a whole week of firearms training makes them more reliable than almost anyone else.

Research the duites of all peace officers before you start making an arguement where you look completely stupid.

[CaberTosser]

The security staff at hospitals have to deal with an absurd number of weirdos, drunks and junkies whose lifestyles have them frequenting hospitals more than most. Then theres also the mentally ill, or those who are all of the above. A few years back I broke a toe and went to the downtown Sheldon Chumuir facility and was taken aback at the number of sketchy 'clientele' who were also there. I was pleased to see lots of security measures in place to deal with them; personally I'd not want anything to do with that kind of people, so those with the patience to deal with have my respect.

[Kale_M]

Originally Posted by CaberTosser

The security staff at hospitals have to deal with an absurd number of weirdos, drunks and junkies whose lifestyles have them frequenting hospitals more than most. Then theres also the mentally ill, or those who are all of the above. A few years back I broke a toe and went to the downtown Sheldon Chumuir facility and was taken aback at the number of sketchy 'clientele' who were also there. I was pleased to see lots of security measures in place to deal with them; personally I'd not want anything to do with that kind of people, so those with the patience to deal with have my respect.

Thank you. Welcome to what I deal with everyday as a CPO with ahs in Calgary. I have dealt with all these above mentioned types of people carrying knives, needles and yes firearms. We see people at their very worst. There are a few of us on this fourm that appreciate your kind words. Thanks again

[smithy]

Originally Posted by NPO

You have to look further... only OC and extendable batons are authorized weapons. AHS is no equipped with OC. Look at the act closer

Thanks for your feedback. I checked again and the answer is found in the Peace Officer Regulation (Alberta Regulation 291/2006):

Authorized weapons and equipment4(1) A peace officer may be authorized, by the peace officer’s
appointment under section 7 of the Act, to carry and use the
following weapons:
(a) OC spray, being a device designed to be capable of
injuring, immobilizing or otherwise incapacitating a
person by the discharge of Oleoresin Capsicum spray
using a concentration approved or specified by the
Director;
(b) a baton;
(c) a firearm, for peace officers employed or engaged by the
Crown in right of Alberta or Canada, or by an employer
authorized under section 3 of the Peace Officer
(Ministerial) Regulation;
(d) a shotgun, for peace officers employed or engaged for
services by any other authorized employer;
(e) a conducted energy device, being a device that is designed
to be capable of injuring, immobilizing or incapacitating a
person by discharging an electrical charge produced by
means of the amplification or accumulation of the
electrical current generated by a battery, where the device
is designed or altered so that the electrical charge may be
discharged when the device is of a length of less than 480
millimetres, and any similar device;

[slivers86]

Originally Posted by smithy

Thanks for your feedback. I checked again and the answer is found in the Peace Officer Regulation (Alberta Regulation 291/2006):

Authorized weapons and equipment4(1) A peace officer may be authorized, by the peace officer’s
appointment under section 7 of the Act, to carry and use the
following weapons:
(a) OC spray, being a device designed to be capable of
injuring, immobilizing or otherwise incapacitating a
person by the discharge of Oleoresin Capsicum spray
using a concentration approved or specified by the
Director;
(b) a baton;
(c) a firearm, for peace officers employed or engaged by the
Crown in right of Alberta or Canada, or by an employer
authorized under section 3 of the Peace Officer
(Ministerial) Regulation;
(d) a shotgun, for peace officers employed or engaged for
services by any other authorized employer;
(e) a conducted energy device, being a device that is designed
to be capable of injuring, immobilizing or incapacitating a
person by discharging an electrical charge produced by
means of the amplification or accumulation of the
electrical current generated by a battery, where the device
is designed or altered so that the electrical charge may be
discharged when the device is of a length of less than 480
millimetres, and any similar device;

Key word here is 'authorized employers'

Many employers of Peace Officers in the province have applied to have their CPO 1's armed, however the province continues to reject applications. Look at the M.D Peace Officers who do highway patrol (3 digit highways) and enforce other laws be TSA, criminal, or whatever! Why are these guys and gals, who enter the same unknown each time they step out of their vehicle as an RCMP, sherriff, or CPS/EPS, not armed?

Its not a debate which has just risen, do a little google search - which might be new to a lot of you looking at past threads which have been repeated a million times. I'm sure you'll find many past threads on multiple boards talking about this, its just the only time you can get media attention is when someone passes away.

Kind of like getting a lit crosswalk sign. You might bitch and whine about a bad crosswalk, complain to your local chamber, but wont have anything done about it until someone gets killed. Same with bad intersections, highways, etc.

Give your heads a shake, and thanks for the support to those who see what we do.

[Rocky7]

Originally Posted by greylynx

You would be surprised about the number of cabbies who pack guns.

Very scary.

I've seen more than one study that cabbies are more likely to be killed at work than police officers.

Why is it scary if they are armed??

[Rocky7]

Originally Posted by slivers86

Many employers of Peace Officers in the province have applied to have their CPO 1's armed, however the province continues to reject applications.

Is it "the Province" that rejects those applications or the CFO?

The CFO takes direction from the RCMP.

[mark-edmonton]

Originally Posted by Kale_M

Thank you. Welcome to what I deal with everyday as a CPO with ahs in Calgary. I have dealt with all these above mentioned types of people carrying knives, needles and yes firearms. We see people at their very worst. There are a few of us on this fourm that appreciate your kind words. Thanks again

Ambulance attendants deal with all these same people and more. Are you suggesting they should carry as well! We have real cops in this province that carry side arms. Basic security peace officers should not in my opinion be able to. They carry other measures, they have no need to carry deadly force weapons, nor do they have the qualifications or training to do so

[Lone_Wolf]

ENOUGH of these posts claiming Peace Officers cannot be armed as they are not trained. Well guess what---if they do get approved to be armed they will also receive the proper training to carry a sidearm.