Pmo offices tells RCMP to return seized firearms ASAP.

[huntinstuff]

No chance in hell of getting a conviction after a mandatory evacuation order is put out.

There are 100 legit reasons why the firearms would be in plain sight.

I wish the RCMP would spend more time catching bad guys than picking low hanging fruit. Its lazy, non-sensible policing at its best.

Their brass needs some polish. The guys on the street need to fire back at the brass and take them to task. But, that wont happen because everyone is for "me", not the "team".

[claykuch]

Firearms are delicate things. Do you think the police put each gun into a case to prevent damage? No. I bet they were banged around and put in piles. Lots of damage.

[Unregistered user]

Originally Posted by Jordan Smith

I love how it says "The guns will be returned to owners after residents are allowed back in town and they provide proof of ownership, Topham added."

How many people can provide proof of ownership for a firearm that they bought 2nd hand, now that the registry is gone?

Why should people have to prove ownership of property that the cops stole from them? The cops should be crucified for this and the crime-boss that gave the orders to steal from law-abiding citizens should be burned at the stake. There is no way in hell I can "PROVE" ownership of most of my property, as it should be. "Ownership is 9/10ths of the law" , right?

[KegRiver]

The brass needs more then a little polish and the good officers need more then a little help from us.

I'd be willing to bet that the order to confiscate those guns came from head office, not from a local office or officer.

Remember the Gomery inquiry into the sponsorship scandal?

Where did the orders come from and who paid the price?

Answer, The orders came from the top and the whistle blowers paid the price.
And those same people at the top, oversee the RCMP, and our laws.

[Chewbacca]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

It would be quite interesting if firearms are reported missing from a home that the RCMP broke into, and the RCMP do not have those firearms?

I don't think I would like to be the one caught with with a gun that was reported as missing or stolen.

[sailor]

Cops have handguns and plastic(metal) rifles.Unfortunately many of them have no clue how to treat and love the walnut stock.
Not only cops. I saw a lot military guys with the same attitude-personally,I would kick their asses off Forces.
Well, find then who is going to work for this pathetic salary...

[Big Daddy Badger]

Well this thing is starting to overshadow the flood itself in the news now.

I'm pretty sure that there will be blood... so to speak.

People... even non gun owners are starting to see that the same thing could have happened to them. They are beginning to realize that it is a slippery slope that ends with a police state.

One final point.

If the police used the license database or the registry of restricted weapons to identify and target homes... that might be problemetic regardless of whether they entered homes unlawfully or not.

My point is that those lists are maintained for three reasons.

One... to make sure that those holding, buying etc guns are licensed and...

Two... to investigate gun related crime.

Three... to track the movement of certain...lawfully owned firearms.

There is no mention within the Act that those records can be used to "secure" firearms for absentee home owners.
There is no mention in the Act of using that information to seize weapons that are lawfully owned unless the owner is suspected of having commited a crime.

So...if they went on a fishing trip using those data bases... and they were not investigating an actual crime or confirming a license....They may be well outside of the limits of use...mandated by the Act.

In other words this could been seen as an abuse of position and a criminal Privacy Act violation even before the homes were entered and the guns taken. It could also be seen as criminal violation of the Firearms Act in that the information was used in a manner other than prescribed within the Act.

If so... this could be a gift and a perfect opportunity for the firearms community to demand change to our firearms laws.
On the grounds that... as we feared... the present laws are subject to abuse by the police and unfairly bias against lawful owners and could result in unreasonable scruitin, and inposition of a reasonable expectation of privacy.

Just a thought.

[sailor]

Pesky dont want to derail the thread.Just confused .From former avatar I was sure you were politician.Now I see pensioner who has good cooking wife

[Big Daddy Badger]

Originally Posted by sailor

Pesky dont want to derail the thread.Just confused .From former avatar I was sure you were politician.Now I see pensioner who has good cooking wife

Just a stump jumper from BC that spent that last 27 plus years negotiating the political minefeld that is DND.

My wife is a good cook though.

[Pathfinder76]

Someone ought to give these clowns a hammer, pinch bar and a shovel and tell them to earn their keep. Or if nothing else make themselves useful.

[elkhunter11]

I don't think I would like to be the one caught with with a gun that was reported as missing or stolen.

You can't get caught with a gun that never existed.

[Grizzly Adams]

Originally Posted by MtnGiant

Yes they did answer that question.....read the other thread.

No safe break ins....only the one's laying in the open.

Not to self: If I have to abandon my home , store all firearms in attic, out of sight and most likely to stay dry.


Grizz

[Big Daddy Badger]

Originally Posted by Grizzly Adams

Not to self: If I have to abandon my home , store all firearms in attic, out of sight and most likely to stay dry.


Grizz

No kidding.

[MtnGiant]

Originally Posted by sailor

Cops have handguns and plastic(metal) rifles.Unfortunately many of them have no clue how to treat and love the walnut stock.
Not only cops. I saw a lot military guys with the same attitude-personally,I would kick their asses off Forces.
Well, find then who is going to work for this pathetic salary...

Plastic type stocks are for light weight reasons.....
They may have several wood stock firearms in their personal life.

Doesn't seem like you have military experience?????

[russ]

The only thing that should be coming out of the PMO's offices is termination notices for the officers that took it upon themselves to carry out the seizures. Including the boots on the ground and the asses hiding behind desks. Clearly an abuse of power at best, carrying out an illegal order at worst.

If public safety were truly the issue, the kitchen knives should also have been removed from the residences too. Haven't heard of any chef's missing their prize $300 knives...

Fire them all.

[260 Rem]

It is unfortunate that some bozo in the chain of command made such an outrageous decision. A demotion for the resposible officer seems appropriate. I believe everybody will get their firearms back without issues..but the fact remains...they shouldn't need to go through the process. The seizures were wrong. Period......

[russ]

Originally Posted by 260 Rem

It is unfortunate that some bozo in the chain of command made such an outrageous decision. A demotion for the resposible officer seems appropriate. I believe everybody will get their firearms back without issues..but the fact remains...they shouldn't need to go through the process. The seizures were wrong. Period......

Disagree in regards to demotion, these officers abused their powers and public trust. Careers need to end, and end very abruptly. There is no excuse for this.

[elkhunter11]

Disagree in regards to demotion, these officers abused their powers and public trust. Careers need to end, and end very abruptly. There is no excuse for this.

+1 A simple demotion is not enough.

[Pathfinder76]

The trouble is that the SOP with this group is to suspend them with full pay for five years while they investigate.

[260 Rem]

Termination is just not a reality...a bump in rank for this rising star followed by a posting to the northern territories would get some attention among other wannabees. No suspension with pay, but perhaps trips back to civilization twice a year.

[KegRiver]

I don't think demotions are the answer.

The problem is not the front line cops, it is whoever issued the orders and that person or those persons can not be demoted. There is no one to demote them. They run the show. They demote those below them.

What I'm afraid will happen is one or two lower officers may get demoted to cover for those really giving orders.

Or the whole thing will be a big whitewash. That is the more likely outcome.
It is what was attempted in the Buddy Tavares case.
And it is what was successfully done in the James Roszko case.

One thing is sure. if the seizures were unwarranted, there is no way anyone will admit to it and there never will be any proof.

The only proof presented will support the seizures. And it may be legitimate or fabricated. How is one to know. Who will investigate, if there is an investigation.

I wonder what Constable Geoff Mantler is doing these days. And I wonder what he would be doing if there had not been a civilian with a video camera present that day.

I think the answer to the second question is clear. He would be patrolling the streets wearing a uniform. And Buddy Tavares would be serving time.


There were no civilians with video cameras present when those guns were taken. I fear I know where this is headed.

[deanmc]

It would be interesting if the comment about removing firearms because of the money people have invested in them was legally twisted into acceptance of liability on the RCMP's part, for ALL valuables in peoples homes.

[just_dave]

Originally Posted by deanmc

It would be interesting if the comment about removing firearms because of the money people have invested in them was legally twisted into acceptance of liability on the RCMP's part, for ALL valuables in peoples homes.

Haha! Oh yeah, wouldn't that be something.

[pikergolf]

Originally Posted by KegRiver

I don't think demotions are the answer.

The problem is not the front line cops, it is whoever issued the orders and that person or those persons can not be demoted. There is no one to demote them. They run the show. They demote those below them.

What I'm afraid will happen is one or two lower officers may get demoted to cover for those really giving orders.

Or the whole thing will be a big whitewash. That is the more likely outcome.
It is what was attempted in the Buddy Tavares case.
And it is what was successfully done in the James Roszko case.

One thing is sure. if the seizures were unwarranted, there is no way anyone will admit to it and there never will be any proof.

The only proof presented will support the seizures. And it may be legitimate or fabricated. How is one to know. Who will investigate, if there is an investigation.

I wonder what Constable Geoff Mantler is doing these days. And I wonder what he would be doing if there had not been a civilian with a video camera present that day.

I think the answer to the second question is clear. He would be patrolling the streets wearing a uniform. And Buddy Tavares would be serving time.


There were no civilians with video cameras present when those guns were taken. I fear I know where this is headed.

I just hope people will feel free enough to complain when they find out whose guns were taken and why. Keeping quite is such a time of upheaval in their lives and just moving on, will probably look pretty inviting. We as a group need to stand with those that are willing to stand.

[deanmc]

Originally Posted by just_dave

Haha! Oh yeah, wouldn't that be something.

Well they wont let us protect our own stuff. We are expected to run like deer if we see a threat.

[harrydude]

Here's a point. The RCMP ae not letting anyone into the town so it is secure. They are patrolling the area for looters. So why do they need to remove private property?

And as hey did take guns from homes. Now that they are in possession of these guns will they not have to clean and oil then to prevent damage just saying.

And by now why is the town not drained ... The city of Calgary got stuff moving quick.

[wolfhunter]

I think people should get their facts straight, the RCMP where only collecting firearms that were not locked up. Not one person has said on this forum that the only reason they were taking the guns was to keep the guns from falling into the wrong hands. Whose to stop people from breaking into these homes and end up selling them on this forum. It just shows you how many people here just keep there firearms in the closet, if you are a responsibly gun owner then all your firearms should be locked up and I don't mean in your basement closet.

[LuckyStrike]

Originally Posted by harrydude

Here's a point. The RCMP ae not letting anyone into the town so it is secure. They are patrolling the area for looters. So why do they need to remove private property?

And as hey did take guns from homes. Now that they are in possession of these guns will they not have to clean and oil then to prevent damage just saying.

And by now why is the town not drained ... The city of Calgary got stuff moving quick.

As earlier suggested ... my theory is the RCMP saw a perfect event & timing to go on a fishing expedition , under the guise of Public Safety. (Lets look for victims, but really take a shopping list along and break into houses of legit PAL holders, plus anyone who may be suspect in the police eyes)

This incident is a real kick in the teeth to gun owners and people in Canada.

It affects everyone... every single person in this country who thinks the police is paid to serve and protect.

***** Public Safety ****** This is an umbrella for our government to do anything they wish.... A total smoke screen to push the Nanny State on us.

I am personally sick about what has happened in High River and what is going on in Canada.

[harrydude]

Call it organized crime.

[pikergolf]

Originally Posted by wolfhunter

I think people should get their facts straight, the RCMP where only collecting firearms that were not locked up. Not one person has said on this forum that the only reason they were taking the guns was to keep the guns from falling into the wrong hands. Whose to stop people from breaking into these homes and end up selling them on this forum. It just shows you how many people here just keep there firearms in the closet, if you are a responsibly gun owner then all your firearms should be locked up and I don't mean in your basement closet.

Really, and you decided this? I would assume that a locked front and back door means keep out.