Question for the woodworkers SawStop saw?

[Newf]

So my old craftsman table saw (bench top saw on legs) decided to finally quit. Cheap saw, but has done the trick for about 10 years. It was my first saw, and as skill progressed it left some things to be desired. For example I couldn’t use a dado blade, fence would not align precisely and required extra due diligence to make proper cuts, just getting things square took extra effort, not to mention anything at an angle or a bevel! But nonetheless I used it and did what I had to do. So now that it’s finally ready for the dumpster, I’m looking at upgrading to a real quality saw.

After digging around on the internet for the last couple nights looking at various saws I’ve stumbled across the SawStop brand of saws. Now those things have some technology behind them! For those that haven’t seen them, it’s worth a google search, but apparently the basic idea is that if the blade touches flesh it throws a brake, stops the blade and drops it down out of the table. Supposedly saving your finger from being chopped off! Impressed the heck out of me! And yeah they are expensive, but my fingers are worth it. No plans on being a dumb*** and touching the blade on a running saw - but accidents can happen. We all know that. So I’m really leaning towards one of these but as always I’m doing some due diligence and research before hand.

As we all know AO has a background base of knowledge that reaches into a lot of areas besides just the outdoors, so I’m wondering if anybody on here might have any first hand experience with this SawStop brand of saws. Accuracy? Reliability? Safety? Etc.

Any input appreciated.

Thanks.

[Passthru]

That’s all they use in the woodworking shops at NAIT. Same as a regular table saw just with extra safety. Blade and stop mechanism are garbage after the safety is engaged and need to be replaced. Watched a teacher try to cut a piece of soffit on one. Right away the safety mech shut it down because it works buy running low electricity through the blade. It doesn’t cut metal or wet lumber but that’s minor

[pikergolf]

I used them in my apprenticeship as well, very nice running saws, pleasure to use, I liked them better than the Generals. That was 15 years ago though, not sure of the quality of the new ones.

Having said that, for home use, if you use your guards and are safety conscious I don't think they are worth it. Doesn't take much to set them off and about half the time they went off in school they also damaged the blade (knocked teeth off). Gets expensive after a while.

[Redneck 7]

The first year they came out my high school put one in and it saved a couple cuts. The second year they put in a second on for dados. I used them all 4 years at NAIT for my apprenticeship too, they really are a quality saw. Very very nice, well designed and functioning saw, fence measurements are true and the fence stays square. But not only does flesh set the saw off, anything that conducts electricity, like measuring your fence with a tape, if the blade is spinning the slowest before it stops, it will drop if it hits the tape. Or the metal cap for the eraser on the pencil, even wet wood has made it drop before (wet as in melting snow on it or smoked by rain)

[Newf]

Originally Posted by pikergolf

I used them in my apprenticeship as well, very nice running saws, pleasure to use, I liked them better than the Generals. That was 15 years ago though, not sure of the quality of the new ones.

Having said that, for home use, if you use your guards and are safety conscious I don't think they are worth it. Doesn't take much to set them off and about half the time they went off in school they also damaged the blade (knocked teeth off). Gets expensive after a while.

So what was setting them off? Wet wood? Metal? Or were folks accidentally touching the blade?

From what I’ve read and watched on YouTube ruining the blade is pretty much expected if the brake gets triggered. If I buy one, I don’t plan on setting the thing off. EVER. But if it does go off and it works...I think I’ll be happy I had it. Sure is a pricey item, especially for a hobbyist like myself. But if I’m upgrading to quality anyway, and I already have the wife’s blessing - I might as well get what I want.

Might drop into KMS Tools or Lee Valley later today for a first hand look.

[mattthegorby]

I have never used one, but can't resist posting on a thread about tablesaws. I love tablesaws.

I suspect, that the vast majority of tablesaw accidents occur with folks who either do not know the basics of safety or those with tons of experience that got complacent. With proper techniques and quality gaurds in place they are pretty safe in my opinion from the cheap seats.

For safety, I would look at an overarm blade guard, riving knife (or learn about making splitters), big extension and outfeed support, jigs when appropriate, enough power to zip through whatever you are cutting, and a thorough understanding of kickback. Sawstop technology looks awesome, but I would also consider the ways other than cutting up your hand that you can get injured.

[Passthru]

Originally Posted by Newf

So what was setting them off? Wet wood? Metal? Or were folks accidentally touching the blade?

From what I’ve read and watched on YouTube ruining the blade is pretty much expected if the brake gets triggered. If I buy one, I don’t plan on setting the thing off. EVER. But if it does go off and it works...I think I’ll be happy I had it. Sure is a pricey item, especially for a hobbyist like myself. But if I’m upgrading to quality anyway, and I already have the wife’s blessing - I might as well get what I want.

Might drop into KMS Tools or Lee Valley later today for a first hand look.

If you try to cut anything that conducts electricity then it will set off the safety mechanism. Very nice table saws but the price is about double, if I remember right, what you would pay for an equivalent table saw without the safety.

[pikergolf]

Originally Posted by mattthegorby

I have never used one, but can't resist posting on a thread about tablesaws. I love tablesaws.

I suspect, that the vast majority of tablesaw accidents occur with folks who either do not know the basics of safety or those with tons of experience that got complacent. With proper techniques and quality gaurds in place they are pretty safe in my opinion from the cheap seats.

For safety, I would look at an overarm blade guard, riving knife (or learn about making splitters), big extension and outfeed support, jigs when appropriate, enough power to zip through whatever you are cutting, and a thorough understanding of kickback. Sawstop technology looks awesome, but I would also consider the ways other than cutting up your hand that you can get injured.

The sawstop has an awesome riving knife set up, one that's actually thick enough to work.

[fordtruckin]

Used 2 of them at different places. Generally you see them in an educational setting my guess is for liability reasons training new people how to use a saw properly. I never had any issues with the fences or cutting wet wood the 2.5 years I as around them. IMO for a hole owner as previously mentioned if you buy a quality table saw and use it respectfully your just as well off. I have a construction site Rigid tablesaw and it s more than adequate for my needs.

[Grizzly Adams]

Sorry, I wouldn't trust my fingers to a mechanical device on a blade doing a couple of thousand rpm. A device designed for the stupid among us.

Grizz

[Okotok]

They are a quality saw from what I've seen. I do recall using a dado being a pain as I believe you need a special cartridge and have to switch out the standard one or operate the dado without the cartridge and associated protection. My old Canwood still serves me well and should last into the next generation.

[catnthehat]

We had one in our shop for a while because someone in Ssfety department got sold on it , wasn’t used much, we brought the old Rockwell back out and set it up , I found it much easier to deal with .
Guards are in place for a reason , no need to get that close to a blade !
Cat

[CaberTosser]

I want one because my 20+ year old Delta table saw leaves a little to be desired. I’ve still got all of my digits and a healthy respect for my current saw (or any saw for that matter) but I’ll admit the safety factor of the SawStop has appeal, particularly when it comes to showing youngsters the ropes on it.

Regarding the wet wood aspect that could be troublesome on occasion, but of course there could be other options for sawing those pieces.

On a slight tangent, I’m a big fan of the Incra miter gauges, I have the 1000 SE and it’s great. The positive stops and finely etched markings make for great accuracy.

http://www.leevalley.com/us/wood/pag...240,41064&ap=1

[FCLightning]

Cost about $900 more than the Delta Unisaw at the time I was purchasing. Bought the Saw Stop to replace a worn out Unisaw. After using it I thought that I would pay the extra $900 even if it didn't have the safety electronics in it - very solid saw. But don't try to cut off the handle on a hockey stick - apparently what looks like fiberglass wrap has metal fibres in it

[FCLightning]

Originally Posted by CaberTosser

On a slight tangent, I’m a big fan of the Incra miter gauges: http://www.leevalley.com/us/wood/pag...240,41064&ap=1

x2 on the Incra

[FCLightning]

Originally Posted by Okotok

They are a quality saw from what I've seen. I do recall using a dado being a pain as I believe you need a special cartridge and have to switch out the standard one or operate the dado without the cartridge and associated protection. My old Canwood still serves me well and should last into the next generation.

If you switch over to a dado set on a regular basis you would not want the Saw Stop - it really is a pain to switch out.

[CaberTosser]

It sounds to me like it might be nice if SawStop offered a keyed bypass switch so that one could saw wet wood for instance. I’m thinking like the passenger airbag bypass I’ve seen on some vehicles, say if there’s no back seat and you have to have a baby seat in the front of a cargo van because it’s the only seat available. Have a red light illuminated when the safety system is on bypass and a green light for when it’s active.

[riden]

https://marsonequipment.com/collecti...p-36-fence-pkg


This is my saw, I really like it and have no complaints. Gotta say, not many options for this type of saw in Canada anymore. I would rate the saw as similar quality to SawStop. This saw is very portable and comes with built in wheels that allow you to lift the fence extensions and wheel it around like a wheel barrow. Doesn't have a 240 option on motor, but I have cut lots of hickory with it and power is fine.

I used a SawStop contractor saw with the fence upgrade at school for years, really good saw, and tough. My Sawstop was not wired for 240, and doesn't have the motor strength the Laguna has.

I really like the Sawstop saw, but it is just too heavy, that is the big turnoff for me. I no longer have a dedicated wood shop and need some portability. The contractor saw was 350lbs, and no dust collection feature.

Which Sawstop are you looking at?

As someone said, you need a 2nd cartridge to run a dado blade. They can trip accidentally and every time it does, $100 for a new cartridge and another $100 for a new blade.

[riden]

Originally Posted by FCLightning

If you switch over to a dado set on a regular basis you would not want the Saw Stop - it really is a pain to switch out.

If you do it regularly, it's a piece of cake. My gr 9 students could change it.

[riden]

Originally Posted by CaberTosser

It sounds to me like it might be nice if SawStop offered a keyed bypass switch so that one could saw wet wood for instance. I’m thinking like the passenger airbag bypass I’ve seen on some vehicles, say if there’s no back seat and you have to have a baby seat in the front of a cargo van because it’s the only seat available. Have a red light illuminated when the safety system is on bypass and a green light for when it’s active.

There is a keyed bypass. Sawstop is pretty quiet about it though.

[FCLightning]

Originally Posted by CaberTosser

It sounds to me like it might be nice if SawStop offered a keyed bypass switch so that one could saw wet wood for instance. I’m thinking like the passenger airbag bypass I’ve seen on some vehicles, say if there’s no back seat and you have to have a baby seat in the front of a cargo van because it’s the only seat available. Have a red light illuminated when the safety system is on bypass and a green light for when it’s active.

There is one.

[Newf]

Thanks for the input folks. From those that have used them it sounds like a well built piece of machinery.

Just back from Lee Valley Tools. Got a close up inspection of the saw stop machines. The seem very solidly built. And yes they are very expensive. Apart from the safety factor they have built in I’m sure I can get another saw of great quality. While I do have a very healthy respect for any saw or power tool, the fact that I now know about these saws, I think I might have to go this route. If some how I have a brain fart in the future and loose a digit...How much would I kick myself knowing that a few hundred bucks might have saved a finger?

Going through the various options, I think the contractor model with the cast iron wings will be the route I take on this. The upgrade from the craftsman saw to this thing will be like jumping from a Pontiac firefly to a new Camaro. Won’t buy it just yet... but I think by spring one of these things will be taking up some real estate in the garage.

On another note, it turns out Festool bought SawStop last year. I think that has to speak something for the quality. I can’t imagine Festool being associated with crappy equipment.

[Night Owl]

I have used the Saw Stop for the past 12 years.
We have had 180 apprentices come through NAIT every 2 months and have never had a cut worse than a knick of the skin if the contact is ever on flesh. So that is approximately 10800 apprentices, 1st year to 4th year and all years use the saw at least 4 weeks out of 8 weeks. Some have very little skill with a hand saw let alone a table saw but we train the all to use the saws. the saw cannot prevent kick back or carpenter miss use but they do prevent any accidents that draw blood or cut off the digits.

The saw sensor is set off by tape measures, fingers, nails, small staples that make contact with the blade while in revolution. There are different brakes(stops) for saw and dado sets, make sure you get both, one is wider than the other. Each time the brake goes off its a new brake and usually a new blade, $200 plus some times, but you have your fingers.

There is a bypass for the stop so you can cut certain materials that conduct electricity, wet lumber and PT Lumber. I don't cut metal with my good table saws. And Saw Stop provides you with instructions on how to shut off the sensor when needed, pain in the butt each time.

They call this the Wiener saw, not sure I would put my wiener there to test but have no issue putting my hand there.

[Newf]

Well after much deliberation, googling and talking with a few folks, I decided to pull the trigger on a SawStop PCS. One of the deciding factors to make the purchase was that the price is going up as of Feb 1. Plus I had full support from my wife who actually sort of pushed me to go for it. So that made it that much easier. :-)

It’s an awful lot of money, especially for a hobbiest like myself, but I realize I’m paying for a safety feature that I HOPE to NEVER use.

Now for a few little projects....

[pikergolf]

Congrats on an awesome saw! Enjoy yourself!

[urban rednek]

Thread revived to add pertinent video link!
This short video is a real life example of how well these devices work.

https://imgur.com/gallery/MdDQHtl

There are no details/context provided. It looks like he may have been making a poorly thought out instructional video.

[eagleflyfisher]

Originally Posted by urban rednek

Thread revived to add pertinent video link!
This short video is a real life example of how well these devices work.

https://imgur.com/gallery/MdDQHtl

There are no details/context provided. It looks like he may have been making a poorly thought out instructional video.

Good lord that is nasty.
bTW I have had a saw stop for about 1.5 yrs.
Love the upgrade from my old general.

[pikergolf]

Originally Posted by urban rednek

Thread revived to add pertinent video link!
This short video is a real life example of how well these devices work.

https://imgur.com/gallery/MdDQHtl

There are no details/context provided. It looks like he may have been making a poorly thought out instructional video.

Rule 1 in wood working, the wood gets fed against the rotation of the blade.

[ddeacon]

I got a small business and no matter what you tell your staff s#!+ happens. Saved a finger on 2 staff and ironically, my own finger was the first to be saved... even after 20 years of table saw use. $125 every once In a while for a new brake is worth it. There is a bypass available and they really are a very quality saw in comparison to other options. I now own 2 of them and would never buy a different saw.

[riden]

Edit

Blonde moment there.