How bad does it have to get before Albertans decide separation is the best option?

[KGB]

Originally Posted by cody j

Open carry and $5 Copenhagen? I’m in!

And Backwoods Aromatic! I want those too!

[KGB]

Originally Posted by W921

Anglo's leaving Québec is what they wanted. I would love it if all the leftists ,weed twisting,gun hating hippies got out of Alberta. I actually think we should be doing things so they will get out of here.
Example we could hire Brazil to take care of our prison system. When we catch a bad guy we ship him to Brazil to become rehabilitated and make it hard for therm to ever come back.
We outlaw drugs ,sparkles and anything else they love.
We offer one way airline tickets and public housing in Ottawa. Free rent for 6 months.
We outlaw vagrancy and build public rifle ranges ,etc. Make a game out of thinking of ways we could encourage these people who ruin everything to leave the province.
Right now we probably have the best Premier that we ever had and Pierre Poilievre stands a good chance of being next Prime Minister. Let's not split the vote and end up with another liberal crook Prime Minister.
I was a big Reform guy back in the day. All we did was split the vote and gave several elections to Liberals

Jesus, hey Jesus! Are you listening? I know you are, so please please please make it happen!

[Drewski Canuck]

One small step to prove the point of Alberta's contribution to the rest of Canada, and a point I have raised since Premier Stelmach, is a Provincial tax on income earned by Non Resident Canadians who come and work in Alberta.

VERY VERY easy to demonstrate the value to the rest of Canada, and if the Government follows through with such an Income Tax to benefit Albertans, a pool of money which is in Alberta for our own special purposes, like a separate Heritage Fund, or maybe Nuclear Power Stations, or better schools and hospitals, ...

This is the fundamental problem with all Provincial Premiers, they ignore the Provincial Income Tax being brought home by the come from away workers and it is a windfall to these Premiers who do not have to create jobs for their citizens because Alberta does the dirty work.

But I am a voice unheard, again, and again, and again...


Drewski

[Gammaboy]

Originally Posted by Drewski Canuck

One small step to prove the point of Alberta's contribution to the rest of Canada, and a point I have raised since Premier Stelmach, is a Provincial tax on income earned by Non Resident Canadians who come and work in Alberta.

VERY VERY easy to demonstrate the value to the rest of Canada, and if the Government follows through with such an Income Tax to benefit Albertans, a pool of money which is in Alberta for our own special purposes, like a separate Heritage Fund, or maybe Nuclear Power Stations, or better schools and hospitals, ...

This is the fundamental problem with all Provincial Premiers, they ignore the Provincial Income Tax being brought home by the come from away workers and it is a windfall to these Premiers who do not have to create jobs for their citizens because Alberta does the dirty work.



But I am a voice unheard, again, and again, and again...


Drewski

Arent there now provincial tax credits for tradesmen to move to Alberta? I don't know that it will entice people to move but it may get people who already work here but file taxes in their home province to file as Albertans? Its a win for both Alberta and the worker because the worker pays less tax and Alberta gets a reduced amount of money the worker would have paid to his province of origin.
I may be wrong so feel free to correct me. And yes, the Albertan payroll tax sounded horrible on the radio but when explained it was a great idea (Albertans have a knee jerk response to any tax, that proposal should have been explained further for sure)

[silvertip]

Alberta to separate, I'm all for it, going to be tuff

but.....

If like minded people hit up Saskatchewan and Manitoba together as one and possible
the Yukon ,
could and will make some politicians cringe.

We wouldn't be landlocked as there would be the Port of Churchill.

There are some pretty smart business people out there!! ( maybe already discussed )

Lots of raw materials in the three prairie provinces and I know we could make it work.

Personal I would just love to see the Laureation elite kiss our butts for once.

Right now Trudeau is in our province buy up votes like crazy.

I'm scared he will make inroads in Edmonton and Calgary deeper than they
already are.

[I’d rather be outdoors]

Originally Posted by silvertip

Right now Trudeau is in our province buy up votes like crazy.

I'm scared he will make inroads in Edmonton and Calgary deeper than they
already are.

Haha yeah, I’m gonna go with there’s basically 0 chance of that happening.

[Sloughsharkjigger]

Alberta separating from Canada… hum what would that look like.

Friends and brothers from other parts of Canada would need to provide credentials to enter Alberta… put a gate on highways so someone from Alberta needs to open and close it? no… wait… Alberta will suddenly create an effective police and military force that can prevent intrusions from other Canadians or worse - people visiting from some 3rd world. Will only cost you 20 cents a month.

Separation talk - at best - is a half baked idea with little thought behind it.

[Ariu]

Not all citizens are full citizens of Canada if tax monies only flow EAST from the territories in the west. And the East gets to decide about environment, guns, taxes...
I think AB should try a couple of things.
Have a senate similar to the US which would prevent the Canadian government imposing their policies to AB.
AB pension plan.
Adjust equalization payment formula. Quebec won (stole from NFLD) the hydro power lottery as produces so much electricity, exported to NY & ON for profit. But Quebec hydro profits not included in the federal equalization payment formula. So in Alberta, oil revenues are included but Quebec has no such Hydro profits included for equalization.

If no success, f... it... lets go. Even Yugoslavian style if needed.

[Sundog57]

Quebec won (stole from NFLD) the hydro power lottery as produces so much electricity, exported to NY & ON for profit. But Quebec hydro profits not included in the federal equalization payment formula. So in Alberta, oil revenues are included but Quebec has no such Hydro profits included for equalization.

This is not quite true
Quebec did negotiate an insane deal for the power generated by Churchill Falls which they in turn sell to the US. It should be remembered that at the time, 1966 Newfoundland had no means (and there was really no technically feasible means at the time) to transmit power via any route than through Quebec.
No question the Quebecers jammed it to them, but the Newfoundlanders were so desperate for money that they signed a bad deal. Quebec continues to do the nasty to them as they forced a renewal at some ridiculoously low rate quite recently - but it was part of the contract so make a bad deal eat nasty stuff for a looong time.
https://www.heritage.nf.ca/articles/...hill-falls.php
The rest of the electricity that Quebec produces is generated inside of Quebec - they have been extremely aggressive in developing hydro power as there is a seemingly endless market in the US and they have a huge resource base.
The income generated from hydro is defined as being natural resource income and as a result is not included in the calculation for equalisation. This is the same right across the country so oil royalties in Alberta are not counted either.
However the difference is that only directly generated income is counted - so you build a dam and all the infrastructure and then there is very little in the way of other costs, the subsequent employment level from the projects is very low so they don't generate much in the way of other tax income. In Alberta by contrast, in order to generate those oil royalties, you have to employ a huge number of very well paid people. Their income and the associated taxes are not considered as natural resource income and so is counted for equalisation.

This allows Quebec to generate something to the tune of $14 billion in electricity sales annually that is not counted (as opposed to about 4 billion in Alberta).

As for the question of is the rest of Canada taking it in the shorts from Quebec, it sure seems like it...

[Big Grey Wolf]

Canada is one of the best countries in the world, anyone that wants to break up this wonderful country should be taken to Vancouver, set adrift in old boats and wish them goodluck in finding a better country.
PS Just need to vote and get rid of the Turd.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by Big Grey Wolf

Canada is one of the best countries in the world, anyone that wants to break up this wonderful country should be taken to Vancouver, set adrift in old boats and wish them goodluck in finding a better country.
PS Just need to vote and get rid of the Turd.

But what if Trudeau gives away another 100 Billion to buy votes, and changes the electoral system, and is re elected? At what point do you say enough is enough? Do you wait until Canada is bankrupt, we lose our pensions, and social programs, and our taxes get doubled to try and keep solvent? It's like being in a sinking ship, at some point, you need to give up on the ship, and get into the lifeboats, and try to save your life.

[HyperMOA]

Canada was one of the best countries in the world, anyone that doesn’t want to break up this indentured confederation should be taken to Vancouver, and given their new citizenship, in old safe-injection sites and wish them goodluck in finding more apathy and aocialism.
PS Just need to vote and get rid of the Turd. Then again in 10 years we just need to vote out the next further left turd. Then again and again until we truly are just grist for the socialist mill.

[W921]

Everybody hates Quebec but Quebec has right idea. Currently its just unfair that because of the amount of federal seats Quebec and Ontario have so they have all the power and always will.

Only real solution is an Elected ,Effective and Equal Senate that controls Federal spending. Example each province elects two senators that can vote on everything.
More power to provinces, Ottawa's job is to issue currency, defend border's and break up monopolies.
This way if libtards in Ontario and Quebec want to be stupid then let them do what they want but dont expect Alberta to pay for it.
About being land locked. Switzerland is land locked and seems to do quite well.
About it being to late and to many bad people in the country. Example some on here are against elected Sheriff's. Why should people who dont own land or a business be able to vote but they dont even ever plan on owning anything in the future. They just move from place to place voting for same stupidity and when they wreck that place then they move to some other place and complain and wreck that place as well.They dont care because they have no skin in the game and nothing to lose. They should not be able to vote.

[pikergolf]

Originally Posted by Big Grey Wolf

Canada is one of the best countries in the world, anyone that wants to break up this wonderful country should be taken to Vancouver, set adrift in old boats and wish them goodluck in finding a better country.
PS Just need to vote and get rid of the Turd.

It's not Trudeau, it's the people that vote socialist. They are not like me, and they will not change. They want to be looked after, less thinking is better for them.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by pikergolf

It's not Trudeau, it's the people that vote socialist. They are not like me, and they will not change. They want to be looked after, less thinking is better for them.

Exactly, some people want to blame Trudeau for our situation, but the real problem is the people that vote for that fool. When Trudeau is gone, they will just vote for his replacement.

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by pikergolf

It's not Trudeau, it's the people that vote socialist. They are not like me, and they will not change. They want to be looked after, less thinking is better for them.

Wise words once again Piker

[warriorboy10]

Many decades past time for Alberta to be independent! Does nothing for Alberta to be part of this existing federal one way system other than a cash cow for Quebec and the feds! Alberta votes mean nothing and yet Quebec and the Feds continuously help themselves to billion upon billions of Alberta dollars.

Want to straighten sh*t out? Fightback with a revolution! Its coming!!

[zabbo]

Originally Posted by Big Grey Wolf;47148https://thecanadianindependent.substack.com/p/watch-kevin-oleary-slams-canadian43

Canada is one of the best countries in the world, anyone that wants to break up this wonderful country should be taken to Vancouver, set adrift in old boats and wish them goodluck in finding a better country.
PS Just need to vote and get rid of the Turd.

Actually, canukistan WAS one of the best countries in the world!! Unfortunately we have this: Kevin O'Leary tells it like it is!!!

https://thecanadianindependent.subst...slams-canadian

[coolpete1]

federal government should be made of 3 equal reginal governments , no more toronto decides for everyone . Or provinces become republics of the union like the usa , either way no more toronto

[calgarychef]

Originally Posted by Sundancefisher

The Federal Peovincial relationship sucks. Alberta has been feeding the socialist provinces like Ontario, Quebec, BC and the maritimes for way too long at the same time some of them has blocked our oil and gas from market, which sale helps supply those transfer payments. Hydro uses Canadian water… Quebec should be paying us a royalty.

That all said…

Segregation as in becoming a separate company is impossible. First Nations won’t go and they won’t give up their rights to whatever. Alberta shouldn’t take on that social cost either. It will eventually crush the economy down the road.

We would also be landlocked. US would jack up our costs for everything.

We would be SOL on National Parks… they’d go to Canada.

Transportation of goods and border protects would be very expensive.

Likely we would remove the need for bilingualism which would cost money to switch.

We would need a much higher level public service to cover everything… more expensive in theory.

The conversation should instead center around getting the appropriate number of seats in parliament based upon our increasing population.

We should demand all autonomy that Quebec has and simply say we want equal treatment.

Arguing for an impossibility is a waste of energy. Arguing for doable change makes sense.

This makes sense

[Mr. Bigglesworth]

Originally Posted by huntinstuff

Most guys on here cant figure out the hunting draws system......how in hell could they form self government?

Amen to that.

[W921]

Originally Posted by calgarychef

This makes sense

How does it make sense? So basically we want same thing as treaty guys but on a provincial level but treaty people won't allow it? And our parks belong to Ottawa or the UN ??

[W921]

Originally Posted by Mr. Bigglesworth

Amen to that.

Only French lawyers born with silver spoons know anything.

[Ballertrawler II]

I hate to say it but it is way too late, we have a lot of immigrants that will vote for Trudeau here in Alberta.

They are here because the free money has run out and they need to work so they come to Alberta.

They will work hard at jobs many other people turn their nose up at and keep expenses low by sourcing their own food and communal living which again we choose not to do.

To me your votes should only count for landowners and real estate owners.otherwise you are not eligible as you dont own a piece of canada

[Cement Bench]

Originally Posted by warriorboy10

Many decades past time for Alberta to be independent! Does nothing for Alberta to be part of this existing federal one way system other than a cash cow for Quebec and the feds! Alberta votes mean nothing and yet Quebec and the Feds continuously help themselves to billion upon billions of Alberta dollars.

Want to straighten sh*t out? Fightback with a revolution! Its coming!!

I am in

[Cement Bench]

Originally Posted by Ballertrawler II

I hate to say it but it is way too late, we have a lot of immigrants that will vote for Trudeau here in Alberta.

They are here because the free money has run out and they need to work so they come to Alberta.

They will work hard at jobs many other people turn their nose up at and keep expenses low by sourcing their own food and communal living which again we choose not to do.

To me your votes should only count for landowners and real estate owners.otherwise you are not eligible as you dont own a piece of canada

agreed unless you file a tax return you cannot vote
or if you are a registered senior getting benefits you have earned

[densa44]

What would it take to get better candidates at all levels of government? How about a criminal records check, accurate C.V. 35 years of age, 10 years ofcontinuous successful work history, 5 years of running your own company?

Many of these problems could be addressed if we at least had better politicians, like some of you guys, it make no sense to complain about the guy doing the job it they are doing thier best. If you think that you can do better, and you probably can, please run!

Do you realy think Mrs. Smith is a better priemier than Peter Lougheed?

[PartTimeHunter]

Originally Posted by Sooner

I have been voting since I was 18 and am 57 now. Only seen a few Conservative governments rule the land in that time. What I have seen election after election is how more than not, the east makes up my mind long before I cast a vote.

If PP & crew can't knock that turd and his crooks out and soundly, after everything they have done this time around, any future federal votes will be protest votes to either a AB bloc party or separation party. If my vote don't matter anyway, why bother supporting the big blue one.

I have had more than enough of the east/libs sticking it to the west.

Few years older but the same story. Last chance for my vote as a conservative. Have never voted for any other than a conservative party

[I’d rather be outdoors]

Originally Posted by densa44

What would it take to get better candidates at all levels of government? How about a criminal records check, accurate C.V. 35 years of age, 10 years ofcontinuous successful work history, 5 years of running your own company?

Many of these problems could be addressed if we at least had better politicians, like some of you guys, it make no sense to complain about the guy doing the job it they are doing thier best. If you think that you can do better, and you probably can, please run!

Do you realy think Mrs. Smith is a better priemier than Peter Lougheed?

Has Smith made mistakes? yes. Is she doing a good job now? Also yes. Could things still get better? Yes again. Baby steps. Way better than nut bar left winger alternatives. Pierre is also great, no complaints but he’s got a massive amount of damage to undo. Look at what the left wing circus candidates have to offer and that’ll put things in perspective.

[6.5 shooter]

Originally Posted by Sundancefisher

The Federal Peovincial relationship sucks. Alberta has been feeding the socialist provinces like Ontario, Quebec, BC and the maritimes for way too long at the same time some of them has blocked our oil and gas from market, which sale helps supply those transfer payments. Hydro uses Canadian water… Quebec should be paying us a royalty.

That all said…

Segregation as in becoming a separate company is impossible. First Nations won’t go and they won’t give up their rights to whatever. Alberta shouldn’t take on that social cost either. It will eventually crush the economy down the road.

We would also be landlocked. US would jack up our costs for everything.

We would be SOL on National Parks… they’d go to Canada.

Transportation of goods and border protects would be very expensive.

Likely we would remove the need for bilingualism which would cost money to switch.

We would need a much higher level public service to cover everything… more expensive in theory.

The conversation should instead center around getting the appropriate number of seats in parliament based upon our increasing population.

We should demand all autonomy that Quebec has and simply say we want equal treatment.

Arguing for an impossibility is a waste of energy. Arguing for doable change makes sense.

I disagree I think the USA would scoop us up in a heart beat! Pipe lines from Alberta, Alaska to the gulf states. Several ocean ports if Manitoba and northern BC join in and MOST importantly FRESH water for sates like California etc.