Home Brew

[KegRiver]

Are there any other home brewers on site?

I'm looking for some ideas on making wine with High Bush Cranberries.

I have no problems with Chokecherry wine and other wines but I've also been trying to make wine with High Bush cranberries and am getting mixed results.

I kinda want to get this figured out because they are the most abundant and easy to pick wild berry close to me. And they don't seem to be good for much else.

Two years ago I made a batch more or less by accident. It smelled odd while fomenting but was the best wine I've ever made once it was done.

So I tried another batch this year and it's aging now. I am not crazy about the taste of this batch.

Both brews were made with four gallons of berries steam juiced down to two gallons of juice. The first batch was on the strong side taste wise so this time I diluted the juice 50/50 with water.

I don't see how that would change the taste though so I'm wondering if there is some other reason for the poor taste.

There were three differences in the two batches.

That first batch was made with berries picked while they were still firm.
This fall I got busy with the harvest and didn't get to pick any until they were mostly liquid inside and I'm wondering if that may be the reason for the taste.

I did add more sugar this year but again I don't see that changing the taste. I added five pounds this year and only four the previous batch.

And although I intended to add yeast to the first batch I didn't because it started fomenting on it's own before I got to it.
This year I added one packet of Lalvin EC 1118 yeast.

Everything else was the same, one teaspoon of Yeast energizer,, and one teaspoon of acid blend.

Did I miss something or do something wrong? Would crushing the berries and brewing them whole work better.

What has been your experience with brewing high bush cranberries?

[omega50]

Originally Posted by KegRiver

Are there any other home brewers on site?

I'm looking for some ideas on making wine with High Bush Cranberries.

I have no problems with Chokecherry wine and other wines but I've also been trying to make wine with High Bush cranberries and am getting mixed results.

I kinda want to get this figured out because they are the most abundant and easy to pick wild berry close to me. And they don't seem to be good for much else.

Two years ago I made a batch more or less by accident. It smelled odd while fomenting but was the best wine I've ever made once it was done.

So I tried another batch this year and it's aging now. I am not crazy about the taste of this batch.

Both brews were made with four gallons of berries steam juiced down to two gallons of juice. The first batch was on the strong side taste wise so this time I diluted the juice 50/50 with water.

I don't see how that would change the taste though so I'm wondering if there is some other reason for the poor taste.

There were three differences in the two batches.

That first batch was made with berries picked while they were still firm.
This fall I got busy with the harvest and didn't get to pick any until they were mostly liquid inside and I'm wondering if that may be the reason for the taste.

I did add more sugar this year but again I don't see that changing the taste. I added five pounds this year and only four the previous batch.

And although I intended to add yeast to the first batch I didn't because it started fomenting on it's own before I got to it.
This year I added one packet of Lalvin EC 1118 yeast.

Everything else was the same, one teaspoon of Yeast energizer,, and one teaspoon of acid blend.

Did I miss something or do something wrong? Would crushing the berries and brewing them whole work better.

What has been your experience with brewing high bush cranberries?

Possibly the answer you seek lies within the bolded section. Oddly in the first batch You may have won the wine lottery with a wild strain that should not have survived the steam extraction.
2nd point is a juice filled cranberry is odd. It may be low acid and may have needed extra acid blend specifically Malic

[Red Bullets]

I don't make wines or spirits so not sure. Earlier berries would be different.

I can only suggest the key to the cranberry flavor might be that high bush cranberries' flavor improves after a few frosts. Maybe try picking some berries in late November or December. The berries will be more watery an stink more after a few frosts so it's like a natural fermentation right on the tree.

I love high bush cranberries right off the bush all winter long. Nature's winter treats. One of the few treats even a blind man could find... with his nose.

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by omega50

Possibly the answer you seek lies within the bolded section. Oddly in the first batch You may have won the wine lottery with a wild strain that should not have survived the steam extraction.
2nd point is a juice filled cranberry is odd. It may be low acid and may have needed extra acid blend specifically Malic

I wondered if it were the yeast. I know the 1118 is not the best yeast for wine but it does withstand higher alcohol content which is why I use it.

The wild yeast was most likely airborne. I find that spontaneous fermentation is common during picking season, I believe because there is a lot of aireborn yeast due to all the overripe berries about.

Low acid may also be an explanation. High bush cranberries are not true cranberries and ripen very differently. It is normal for them to be mostly liquid when fully ripe.

For me the big problem is, tried and true recipes for them are almost non existent.
I only found one recipe in all my searching, and it indicated that the author was still experimenting with the fruit.

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by Red Bullets

I don't make wines or spirits so not sure. Earlier berries would be different.

I can only suggest the key to the cranberry flavor might be that high bush cranberries' flavor improves after a few frosts. Maybe try picking some berries in late November or December. The berries will be more watery an stink more after a few frosts so it's like a natural fermentation right on the tree.

I love high bush cranberries right off the bush all winter long. Nature's winter treats. One of the few treats even a blind man could find... with his nose.

For sure the flavor improves with frost, and ripening and that may be the problem. But the best batch was early berries, before there was any frost and before the berries had started to liquefy.

Yet you may be on the right track. I intend to try again next year and make two batches, one with early berries and one with much later berries, after a frost or two.

Although this years berries were later they had not been frozen yet.

I might even try a third batch, and try artificially frost ripening them by freezing early berries before extracting the juice.

That's what makes these berries so attractive for this use. I could pick 10 or twenty gallons of them if I wanted.

This years pick for example was from about a dozen bushes in about forty acres of berry bushes.

I hoped that there would be someone here who has more experience fermenting them then I do. But I'm happy to experiment if I have to.

Now if I could get the grande kids to help with the picking I'd really be in business. LOL

[Au revoir, Gopher]

Yeast are funny beasts... they adapt to their environment very well and that is a big part of the problem. We mere mortals don't have adequate tools to define 'the environment'. We test all sorts of things and add this and that, but we don't really know what is there and what isn't. Sometimes a tried and trued recipe just doesn't work and we don't know why.

I your particular case, I have great sympathy. I had a similar accident the first time I made meade. I was cleaning my honey extraction equipment and had about a half gallon of 'honey water'. I stuck it in a gallon jug, threw in a bit of bread yeast, stuck a lock on top and ignored it for a few weeks. Racked, stabalised and left to age. The results were absolutely amazing! Last three attempts to recreate have been utter failures. I live in hope

Best of luck.

ARG

[philintheblank]

I make a years supply of apple cider every fall. The best way i have found to get the apple flavour in the finished product is do save some of the juice that we press and freeze it until the main batch has finished fermenting, then, right before I bottle or keg, I add the frozen juice back in to the desired sweetness.

The biggest problem is that it needs to remain cold or it will kick off fermentation again.

If you are missing the flavour in your finished wine you could try the same thing with the berries you are using.

I also use Nottingham ale yeast for my cider, seems to help preserve the fruity taste and has a pleasant foamy head

[Reeves1]

Keg ( and others) a mandatory book to have: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/...of_Homebrewing


I've made many berry batches, although not since moving to my present place: bad water.

I'd crush the berries, put in the primary. You need a hygrometer to measure gravity properly & I used corn sugar to bump it up.

Going on memory, I think you need to add peptin (?) to fruit batches. (I'd have to dig out my brewing logs to check)
I added (?) to kill off any wild yeast, them add the proper yeast for what I was making.

For Mead I used a Champagne yeast.
Unlike commercial Mead (that is sweet) I fermented mine out completely, till clear. It was dry & a much better product.
The Ginger Mead made from a recipe from the above book was much like Canada Dry Ginger ale.

[Reeves1]

What is Mead
In essence, mead is defined as yeast-fermented honey water. Now if one should do an imaginative
thing such as add fruit to the honey water, the resulting fermentation is technically called a melomel.
With the addition of grapes, you have a melomel called pyment. Becoming intrigued? Well, hold on,
there's more. A mead infused with herbs and/or spices is called a metheglin. Honey and apple juice
combine to ferment and make cyser. Finally, a spiced pyment (melomel) is called hippocras.
Getting back to simple mead and present-day palates, one is likely to find that haphazardly
fermented honey water is not to one's liking. Traditionally, mead has been and still is a fermented
beverage brewed with the ratio of 1 gallon of water to 2 1/2 -4 pounds of honey, often resulting in a
prolonged fermentation and an intoxicatingly sweet and very enjoyable honey winelike beverage.
As the amount of honey is increased, more of the sugar content of the mead "wort" will not ferment
due to the fact that higher alcohol levels inhibit yeast fermentation.
If you can find commercially made mead, it's likely to be sweet, old and stale, smelling like wet
cardboard or old garbage. Rare is the find of freshly made mead in good "health." But, finding a
commercially made mead in your neighborhood store is improbable. To locate a commercially made
"spiced" or "fruit" mead was impossible up until the early 1990's, when meads began to catch the
fancy of some small breweries and brewpubs. Sometimes you may be fortunate enough to sample some
at a local small brewery. And what a treat it is.
It's another kind of "Relax. Don't worry."

[Reeves1]

Mead, Honeymoons and Love

Who would have thought that the bees, the moon and the magical brews of man could combine to add to the bliss, luster and memories of weddings?
Mead is a beverage of love. The drinking of mead has been held responsible for fertility and the birth of sons. This is where the tradition of the honeymoon got its start. If mead were consumed for one month (one moon) after a wedding, then in nine months a son would be born and the mead maker congratulated. The custom of drinking mead at weddings and for one month after initiated our present-day custom of the honeymoon.
Interestingly, mead drinking developed quite a reputation for its ability to increase the chances of bearing sons. So much so that a special drinking cup, called the Mazer Cup, was handed down from generation to generation. The couple who drank from the cup would bear sons to carry on the family name and increase the male birth rate, important in the days of constant war.
Fact or folly? Scientists have been doing animal experiments and have found they can increase the chances of bearing males by altering the body's pH. It is known that the acidity or alkalinity of the female body during conception can influence the sex of the newborn. Blood sugar levels do alter pH.
Mead is indeed a noble drink. For more than 5,000 years. Virgil, Plato, Plutarch, Zeus, Venus, Jupiter, Odysseus, Circe, the Argonaut, Beowulf, Aphrodite, Bacchus, Odin, Valhalla, the Sanskrit Rig-Veda, Thor, King Arthur, Queen Elizabeth I, the French, Greeks, Mayans, Africans, English, Irish, Swedes, Poles, Hungarians, Germans, present-day homebrewers and even the Australian Aborigines all likened part of their enjoyment of life to mead.
Centuries ago the making of mead was art, regulated by custom and statutes. The brewing of mead was not done by just anyone. Certain individuals were trained and held in the highest esteem for turning honey into the magic of mead.
Today every homebrewer has the know-how to become a dignitary and the maker of mead for those special occasions or for any occasion. The stronger versions keep for years, as does a good marriage.
And as for having sons, you will have to experiment on your own.

[omega50]

Originally Posted by philintheblank

I make a years supply of apple cider every fall. The best way i have found to get the apple flavour in the finished product is do save some of the juice that we press and freeze it until the main batch has finished fermenting, then, right before I bottle or keg, I add the frozen juice back in to the desired sweetness.

The biggest problem is that it needs to remain cold or it will kick off fermentation again.

If you are missing the flavour in your finished wine you could try the same thing with the berries you are using.

I also use Nottingham ale yeast for my cider, seems to help preserve the fruity taste and has a pleasant foamy head

I sort of do the same thing, but I use slack crapapple jelly from the cold room.Usually I have extra jelly left from the previous year. I hit the batch before bottling with Sorbate to prevent re-fermentation in my Apple/Crabapple wine

[walker1]

Not a wine brewer but make a lot of beer. Made 10 g of IPA the other day and a fat Tire clone a few weeks prior. Great hobby. I am following as I am going to try some fruit additions ( raspberry) to some beers next summer!
Cheers!

[3blade]

Diluting it is also a change. 4 changes. Pretty sure you won’t get close with all that. Good thing you kept a record

I’d guess the first batch got a dose of wild yeast from the environment...highly doubt it would survive the extraction process.

Next year pencil it in to your calendar and try to replicate the first batch exactly...if you get the same great product you’re in business. Relatively few wild yeasts in AB and even fewer that produce a good drink. Indeed you might have won the lottery.

If you want to dilute it (this is heresy ) you do it when you are drinking, never during the process.

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by Reeves1

I'd crush the berries, put in the primary. You need a hygrometer to measure gravity properly & I used corn sugar to bump it up.

Going on memory, I think you need to add peptin (?) to fruit batches. (I'd have to dig out my brewing logs to check)
I added (?) to kill off any wild yeast, them add the proper yeast for what I was making.

For Mead I used a Champagne yeast.
Unlike commercial Mead (that is sweet) I fermented mine out completely, till clear. It was dry & a much better product.
The Ginger Mead made from a recipe from the above book was much like Canada Dry Ginger ale.

I have a couple of brewing hydrometers, two different sizes of carboys, a vinometer, thermometers, racking siphons, pectic enzyme, isinglass, bentonite, camden tablets and all that.

I only add peptic enzyme if I'm using crushed fruit. My information says it breaks down the berries which adds flavor. This juice has more then enough flavor. Way more then enough.

The yeast I am using is a Champagne yeast.

Crushing the berries and fermenting them sounds like the best option and the one thing I have never tried with any berries.

But I am fully set up for it now. I wasn't until late this fall.

I was going with the steam extraction because I get very little sediment that way. But if fermenting crushed berries works better I'm all for it.

I have a lot of literature on wine making but I'm always looking for more.
I'll see if I can find that book at my usual sources.

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by Reeves1

What is Mead
In essence, mead is defined as yeast-fermented honey water. Now if one should do an imaginative
thing such as add fruit to the honey water, the resulting fermentation is technically called a melomel.
With the addition of grapes, you have a melomel called pyment. Becoming intrigued? Well, hold on,
there's more. A mead infused with herbs and/or spices is called a metheglin. Honey and apple juice
combine to ferment and make cyser. Finally, a spiced pyment (melomel) is called hippocras.
Getting back to simple mead and present-day palates, one is likely to find that haphazardly
fermented honey water is not to one's liking. Traditionally, mead has been and still is a fermented
beverage brewed with the ratio of 1 gallon of water to 2 1/2 -4 pounds of honey, often resulting in a
prolonged fermentation and an intoxicatingly sweet and very enjoyable honey winelike beverage.
As the amount of honey is increased, more of the sugar content of the mead "wort" will not ferment
due to the fact that higher alcohol levels inhibit yeast fermentation.
If you can find commercially made mead, it's likely to be sweet, old and stale, smelling like wet
cardboard or old garbage. Rare is the find of freshly made mead in good "health." But, finding a
commercially made mead in your neighborhood store is improbable. To locate a commercially made
"spiced" or "fruit" mead was impossible up until the early 1990's, when meads began to catch the
fancy of some small breweries and brewpubs. Sometimes you may be fortunate enough to sample some
at a local small brewery. And what a treat it is.
It's another kind of "Relax. Don't worry."

YIKES !!!! LOL too heavy for my brain LOL

I'll stick with the wine.

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by omega50

I sort of do the same thing, but I use slack crapapple jelly from the cold room.Usually I have extra jelly left from the previous year. I hit the batch before bottling with Sorbate to prevent re-fermentation in my Apple/Crabapple wine

I did that with a batch of kit wine several years ago. It didn't help a lot and like you say, it wants to kick in the fermentation again.

I cold aged mine and then bottled it and put wire wraps on the corks. Even then half of them blew out the corks after a few weeks.
The rest produced a pleasantly bubbly white wine that was rather good but not particularly fruity.

I don't use potasium sorbate or potassium metabisulfite to halt or prevent fermentation. I don't even have potasium sorbate and only use potassium metabisulfite or Sodium Metabisulphite for sterilizing equipment.

I like my wine to be as natural as I can make it.
Risky I know, but so far I have had no issues with doing it this way.

Maybe because I use very hot water for sterilizing. Plus the recommended amount of Sodium Metabisulphite of course.

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by 3blade

Diluting it is also a change. 4 changes. Pretty sure you won’t get close with all that. Good thing you kept a record

I’d guess the first batch got a dose of wild yeast from the environment...highly doubt it would survive the extraction process.

Next year pencil it in to your calendar and try to replicate the first batch exactly...if you get the same great product you’re in business. Relatively few wild yeasts in AB and even fewer that produce a good drink. Indeed you might have won the lottery.

If you want to dilute it (this is heresy ) you do it when you are drinking, never during the process.

I wondered about that too. Our water smells of chlorine and that might make a big difference.

I can get good quality spring water, with a little work. But decided to take a chance on tap water this time. I figured that since I used it in the steam process without issues it should be okay. But I wasn't sure if maybe the steaming gassed off any chlorine.
If not, it could well impart an off taste such as I found.

I used to do all my brewing with airborne yeast. Then again I was only doing one gallon at a time back then. And I didn't have any of the equipment or supplies I have now.
I did that for about ten years so ten batches or so. And it was all Chokecherry or rhubarb fruit.

Now I'm doing seven or more gallons a year. And I'm doing other fruits now too.
In a couple of weeks I'll start a cherry wine, with pincherry and Mongolian Cherry juice.

[hippietrekker]

I've never used the Highbush Cranberries for wine, but I definitely want too - the sheer quantity makes it hard to resist.
I do 23+ litre of Chokecherry wine every year, using the whole berry and crushing them by hand, makes for an excellent product - bottling last year's batch soon, it is excellent if I do say so myself (also, pairs fantastic with wild meat and goes well in a batch of sausage).
When I get around to try cranberries, I would be inclined to try the same method as with Chokecherries.

Brewing is a fantastic hobby, I do a large batch of cider every year and several wines. It's a good lesson in patience.

[Geraldsh]

If your water has strong chlorine let it set for 24 hours and the chlorine will evaporate out. Crushed berries will taste different than steamed to a discerning palate.

If fermenting crushed berries be aware that some fruit stones contain cyanide - what doesn’t kill you will make you stronger

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by Geraldsh

If your water has strong chlorine let it set for 24 hours and the chlorine will evaporate out. Crushed berries will taste different than steamed to a discerning palate.

If fermenting crushed berries be aware that some fruit stones contain cyanide - what doesn’t kill you will make you stronger

I figure to mash the berries not crush them. As you say, cherry pits do contain cyanide. So do Peach and Apricot stones.
Apperantly it has a strong laxitive effect in small quanities.
I recall a childs song that mentioned that. Something about eating chockcherry pits and late night bathroom visits.

I also know from experiance that too many fresh berries have that effect without any cyinide being present.

They have the same effect on Bears too.

I use spring water when I can but if that's not possible leaving the water air out may solve my problem. It's well worth a try.

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by hippietrekker

I've never used the Highbush Cranberries for wine, but I definitely want too - the sheer quantity makes it hard to resist.
I do 23+ litre of Chokecherry wine every year, using the whole berry and crushing them by hand, makes for an excellent product - bottling last year's batch soon, it is excellent if I do say so myself (also, pairs fantastic with wild meat and goes well in a batch of sausage).
When I get around to try cranberries, I would be inclined to try the same method as with Chokecherries.

Brewing is a fantastic hobby, I do a large batch of cider every year and several wines. It's a good lesson in patience.

Agreed.

I get requests for my wines so I guess it must be good. I don't actually drink much of it myself. I just like making it.

There is so much fruit available in season it's a shame to let it all go to waste.
We pick all we can and there is still tons left to spread the plants and feed the birds.
It used to be that everyone around picked wild fruit but these days very few do.

There is always tons of Chokecherry, Crab Apples and highbush cranberries that no one touches.

Some people do pick Blueberries, Raspberries and Saskatoon's but even so there are lots left untouched. We use them for other purposes so they don't wind up getting to the brew room.

I also pick Pin Cherries for jelly and Mountain Cranberries for cranberry jelly but haven't found much use for Chokecherry's or High Bush Cranberries other then for pancake syrup and wine.

[Au revoir, Gopher]

Originally Posted by KegRiver

[...] but haven't found much use for Chokecherry's or High Bush Cranberries other then for pancake syrup and wine.

No chokecherry jelly? I love that stuff... wish I knew what happened to my grandmother's recipe books...

ARG

[omega50]

SunnyCider in Calgary will give you credits of .25 c a lb for your apples and pears and up to $2lb for Berries and applied against future cider purchases. Looking for all kinds of cider fruit in the fall

https://www.sunnycider.ca/fruit-donor-program/

[omega50]

And if you like military history and cider you could hang out here.

https://www.elitebrewing.com/

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by Au revoir, Gopher

No chokecherry jelly? I love that stuff... wish I knew what happened to my grandmother's recipe books...

ARG

I have not tried to make that intentionally. But I did make one batch of syrup that jelled all on it's own. Good stuff.

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by omega50

SunnyCider in Calgary will give you credits of .25 c a lb for your apples and pears and up to $2lb for Berries and applied against future cider purchases. Looking for all kinds of cider fruit in the fall

https://www.sunnycider.ca/fruit-donor-program/

That might be of intrest to those down south.
We have nothing like it up here.

[hillbilly willy]

Hi Keg. I just finished 850 litres and will be bottling another 850 Litres of our Cranberry & Raspberry. We only make it for the Christmas season. If you’d like to call me I would answer any questions you have. Might be easier than typing on my phone. Last year I made 20K litres of wine and am projected to make over 30K litres this year. My number is (seven-eight-zero) 5368744.
Cheers 🍷🍷, William

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by hillbilly willy

Hi Keg. I just finished 850 litres and will be bottling another 850 Litres of our Cranberry & Raspberry. We only make it for the Christmas season. If you’d like to call me I would answer any questions you have. Might be easier than typing on my phone. Last year I made 20K litres of wine and am projected to make over 30K litres this year. My number is (seven-eight-zero) 5368744.
Cheers 🍷🍷, William

Before making a call that may not produce the information I am looking for, is that Cranberry wine or Highbush Cranberry wine that you make?

The two fruits are unrelated and quiet different.

I also wonder, do you sell any of the wine you make.
It sounds very interesting.

I make around 30 liters a year and that's far more then I can drink so I'm thinking you must be selling it somewhere. Or you have a ton of very very good friends. LOL

[omega50]

Originally Posted by KegRiver

Before making a call that may not produce the information I am looking for, is that Cranberry wine or Highbush Cranberry wine that you make?

The two fruits are unrelated and quiet different.

I also wonder, do you sell any of the wine you make.
It sounds very interesting.

I make around 30 liters a year and that's far more then I can drink so I'm thinking you must be selling it somewhere. Or you have a ton of very very good friends. LOL

Or a colony. I helped put up 2 x 22,000 l on colony before I had to rush off.
I was going on a blind date later that nite and I got knuckled on the arm and passed 2 Texas Mickeys of the previous years batch and told: That will do the trick" lol

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by omega50

Or a colony. I helped put up 2 x 22,000 l on colony before I had to rush off.
I was going on a blind date later that nite and I got knuckled on the arm and passed 2 Texas Mickeys of the previous years batch and told: That will do the trick" lol

I never thought of that possibility. I bet they have some real good recipes.

Down home brewing without all the modern additives. That's my kind of brewing.