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  #181  
Old 01-06-2020, 05:06 PM
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OldRussian OldRussian is offline
 
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Default Great news

Great news gents! I got my sheep back today. I wrote a letter to the Minister of the Environment detailing my situations and the discrepancies between the regulations and how the skull is measured.

I received a phone call on 23 December from a gentleman at AEP. He told me I would be having a Merry Christmas and receiving my sheep back once Christmas vacation ends on January 6.

I dropped my tools and went to pick it up as soon as I got the call today.

It sounds like they are in the business of returning sheep. He told me that he has already returned two other sheep and that they are trying to make things right for the hunters. He also stated that changes are on the way to fix the issues. No further detail was given on the potential changes.

I am eating sheep steaks with a wide smile on my face tonight. It was an emotional roller coaster that I don't wish to go through again. The stress it caused will be forgotten in the years to come with this beautiful animal hanging on my wall. I'm glad I am now left with more than pictures to commemorate this accomplishment and challenge.

If you know anyone else who is going through similar issues with the jig tell them to contact the Alberta Minister of the Environment immediately. I can also forward the letter I wrote to them or assist in the process if they PM me.
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  #182  
Old 01-06-2020, 05:50 PM
Harley74 Harley74 is offline
 
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Congratulations , it is refreshing to see a modicum of sanity return to Alberta. Enjoy that Ram
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  #183  
Old 01-06-2020, 06:01 PM
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They screwed up big time on something that was supposed to leave no doubts

LC
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  #184  
Old 01-06-2020, 06:12 PM
OL_JR OL_JR is offline
 
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Awesome to hear OldRussian, congrats on the Ram.
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  #185  
Old 01-06-2020, 09:15 PM
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Fantastic news........I'm glad they figured it out and made it right.
Congrats on the ram!!!
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  #186  
Old 01-06-2020, 09:48 PM
dave99 dave99 is offline
 
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That is great news. Congratulations on a well-deserved ram.


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  #187  
Old 01-07-2020, 08:35 AM
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I am happy to hear this positive end to the story! Thanks for sharing and thanks for all your efforts in advocating for yourself and the rest of us.
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  #188  
Old 01-08-2020, 03:12 PM
alder alder is offline
 
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This is an outstanding development. Congratulations.
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  #189  
Old 01-08-2020, 06:13 PM
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James M James M is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OldRussian View Post
He also stated that changes are on the way to fix the issues.
It sounds to me that there isn’t actually an issue. The regs say eye. The staff say eye socket. The only issue I see is incompetent staff. Easy fix there. I hope they’re reading this. Your staff caused this guy an unnecessary headache to enforce regulations that they made up as they went along.
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  #190  
Old 01-11-2020, 06:09 AM
ram crazy ram crazy is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OldRussian View Post
Great news gents! I got my sheep back today. He also stated that changes are on the way to fix the issues. No further detail was given on the potential changes.
Enjoy it because it’s likely going to be the last sheep you kill! The government is going to take away another resident opportunity by putting sheep on draw and by the sounds of it a no curl requirement. I guess we’ll have to wait and see what happens.
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  #191  
Old 01-11-2020, 06:56 AM
Full Curl Earl Full Curl Earl is offline
 
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Default No curl

Whats a No Curl sheep?
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  #192  
Old 01-11-2020, 07:09 AM
elkhunter11 elkhunter11 is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Full Curl Earl View Post
Whats a No Curl sheep?
No minimum curl requirement, if you draw you can kill any ram, so the success rate will sky rocket, and it will take many, many years to draw a tag as a result.
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  #193  
Old 01-11-2020, 07:58 AM
ram crazy ram crazy is offline
 
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You got it Elk! This will also hurt the quality of rams. When you get drawn for a once in a lifetime tag your going to make dam sure your going to kill a ram!
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  #194  
Old 01-11-2020, 08:17 AM
WinefredCommander WinefredCommander is offline
 
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Sheep should only be allowed for residents of the zone
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  #195  
Old 01-11-2020, 08:21 AM
dave99 dave99 is offline
 
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Originally Posted by ram crazy View Post
Enjoy it because it’s likely going to be the last sheep you kill! The government is going to take away another resident opportunity by putting sheep on draw and by the sounds of it a no curl requirement. I guess we’ll have to wait and see what happens.


I have heard this rumor for years. Not that I doubt that Alberta will eventually go to draw on all sheep, but do you have a source on this?


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  #196  
Old 01-11-2020, 09:10 AM
albertadave albertadave is offline
 
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Originally Posted by ram crazy View Post
You got it Elk! This will also hurt the quality of rams. When you get drawn for a once in a lifetime tag your going to make dam sure your going to kill a ram!
Would it?
Depending on how a draw was managed you'd probably see the overall quality of harvested rams each year increase dramatically.
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  #197  
Old 01-11-2020, 09:42 AM
Pathfinder76 Pathfinder76 is offline
 
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Originally Posted by albertadave View Post
Would it?
Depending on how a draw was managed you'd probably see the overall quality of harvested rams each year increase dramatically.
Are you seriously for this? Or are you one of the drivers?
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  #198  
Old 01-11-2020, 09:58 AM
Pathfinder76 Pathfinder76 is offline
 
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Dave, is FNAWS behind a draw?
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  #199  
Old 01-11-2020, 10:01 AM
DRhunter DRhunter is offline
 
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Originally Posted by ram crazy View Post
You got it Elk! This will also hurt the quality of rams. When you get drawn for a once in a lifetime tag your going to make dam sure your going to kill a ram!

Full disclosure, I have not hunted Sheep yet... but I disagree with your statement that the quality would decrease by having a limited entry draw if there were limited number of draws.

In my opinion, in general zones most animals that make it an inch over 4/5 or full curl are shot as soon as they are legal for the most part. Allowing a reduced harvest would allow some to grow up into some absolute studs. Yes some will be taken that are slightly smaller than 4/5 and will likely absolutely be a trophy in the beholders eye.

If the single goal is to increase trophy quality, then I feel that limiting harvest is the most viable way to do this. I look south to Montana and Missouri River breaks for the trophy quality that has come out of those areas based on a reduced number of tags.

Now if your goal is to increase or maintain opportunity, then Keep on with the minimum requirements, but I think it would be naive to say that a properly managed reduction of tags (and by this I mean all hunter harvest) would not increase overall trophy quality.

DR




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  #200  
Old 01-11-2020, 10:01 AM
WinefredCommander WinefredCommander is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuck View Post
Dave, is FNAWS behind a draw?
Outfitters are 110%! They’re tired of the competition and since our government bends over for outfitters it’ll be them to blame.
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  #201  
Old 01-11-2020, 10:10 AM
Full Curl Earl Full Curl Earl is offline
 
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Default Draw

Sheep draws would likely result in alot of people with grandiose ideas to get fit and one day sheep hunt, which is great! But, lots of folks will not reach that goal and point creep would bog it down. Trophy quality might increase but not without age limitations. Sheep meats tasty, and i see alot of steaks coming off the mountain without a 4/5 or full requirement. But I would like to see a few more WMU’s managed for quality!
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  #202  
Old 01-11-2020, 10:12 AM
WhiteTailAB WhiteTailAB is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dave99 View Post
I have heard this rumor for years. Not that I doubt that Alberta will eventually go to draw on all sheep, but do you have a source on this?


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Would like to know also.
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  #203  
Old 01-11-2020, 10:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRhunter View Post

If the single goal is to increase trophy quality, then I feel that limiting harvest is the most viable way to do this. I look south to Montana and Missouri River breaks for the trophy quality that has come out of those areas based on a reduced number of tags.
Pretty big difference between the breaks and Alberta weather/habitat/predator wise
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  #204  
Old 01-11-2020, 10:22 AM
Pathfinder76 Pathfinder76 is offline
 
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pretty big difference between the breaks and alberta weather/habitat/predator wise
100%
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  #205  
Old 01-11-2020, 10:26 AM
DRhunter DRhunter is offline
 
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Originally Posted by MountainTi View Post
Pretty big difference between the breaks and Alberta weather/habitat/predator wise


No question about that. Despite all of that, some how some of our sheep still manage to survive to just over the legal requirement of harvest and then get shot typically quite quickly after they become legal due to an unlimited opportunity of general tags.

All I am saying is if your single goal is to increase trophy quality, the only way to do it is if there is a managed limited number of tags, some sheep might actually make it to that world class trophy quality without getting shot as soon as they make it just past legal.

DR


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  #206  
Old 01-11-2020, 10:33 AM
elkhunter11 elkhunter11 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRhunter View Post
Full disclosure, I have not hunted Sheep yet... but I disagree with your statement that the quality would decrease by having a limited entry draw if there were limited number of draws.

In my opinion, in general zones most animals that make it an inch over 4/5 or full curl are shot as soon as they are legal for the most part. Allowing a reduced harvest would allow some to grow up into some absolute studs. Yes some will be taken that are slightly smaller than 4/5 and will likely absolutely be a trophy in the beholders eye.

If the single goal is to increase trophy quality, then I feel that limiting harvest is the most viable way to do this. I look south to Montana and Missouri River breaks for the trophy quality that has come out of those areas based on a reduced number of tags.

Now if your goal is to increase or maintain opportunity, then Keep on with the minimum requirements, but I think it would be naive to say that a properly managed reduction of tags (and by this I mean all hunter harvest) would not increase overall trophy quality.

DR




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I haven't hunted sheep nearly as much as many people here, but when I have been out, I saw several illegal rams for every legal ram. Many people that go sheep hunting, are not conditioned or prepared for a several day hunt, so they kill the first legal team they see, and with perhaps one tag in a lifetime, even more people would do that, because they know that they won't get another chance. The result would be high percentage of 3/4 curl or smaller rams.
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  #207  
Old 01-11-2020, 10:46 AM
albertadave albertadave is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuck View Post
Are you seriously for this? Or are you one of the drivers?
I did not say, or even imply, that I was in any way in favour of a draw (BTW I'm not, if it really matters). I simply stated that sheep going on draw would result in an increase in trophy quality.
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  #208  
Old 01-11-2020, 10:48 AM
albertadave albertadave is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuck View Post
Dave, is FNAWS behind a draw?
I don't know. Ask them.
https://www.wsfab.org/
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  #209  
Old 01-11-2020, 10:53 AM
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MountainTi MountainTi is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRhunter View Post
No question about that. Despite all of that, some how some of our sheep still manage to survive to just over the legal requirement of harvest and then get shot typically quite quickly after they become legal due to an unlimited opportunity of general tags.

All I am saying is if your single goal is to increase trophy quality, the only way to do it is if there is a managed limited number of tags, some sheep might actually make it to that world class trophy quality without getting shot as soon as they make it just past legal.

DR


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Oh.....there's still some big sheep around.....

How about habitat enhancement and predator control? That would be my first choice. Throw in an end to unregulated harvest of trophy sheep and you may be surprised with the end result.
Draws are not necessary. Nor is full curl. That idea is about as dumb as the 6 point elk draw
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  #210  
Old 01-11-2020, 11:43 AM
MooseRiverTrapper MooseRiverTrapper is offline
 
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Originally Posted by ram crazy View Post
Enjoy it because it’s likely going to be the last sheep you kill! The government is going to take away another resident opportunity by putting sheep on draw and by the sounds of it a no curl requirement. I guess we’ll have to wait and see what happens.
Can you elaborate on your inside information RC.
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