E-bike battery fires burns TTC train

[Sundancefisher]

https://torontosun.com/news/local-ne...e-bike-battery

Hope in the long run car batteries are made burn proof as people park in underground garages and parkades and attached home garages all the time.

Maybe all these parking areas will also need costly upgrades to bring them up to Lithium battery safety code? If anyone has thought of a code revision yet.

Flying on planes makes me wonder. Do airlines scan all luggage for lithium batteries in their cargo holds and do people buy the protective carry bags for the batteries?

[funkman]

That is very concerning to me that an ebike battery just starts on fire...son has an ebike.

Curious as to how AO members store their ebike batteries during the winter season when not using them. I told him to leave the battery in the detached garage, but he is concerned garage is unheated. Any thoughts?

[ram crazy]

Originally Posted by funkman

That is very concerning to me that an ebike battery just starts on fire...son has an ebike.

Curious as to how AO members store their ebike batteries during the winter season when not using them. I told him to leave the battery in the detached garage, but he is concerned garage is unheated. Any thoughts?

My batteries are stored in a non heated garage and haven't had any issues.

[20shadow05]

I fully charge the e-bike battery for the winter and only charge it when I am home and working in the garage. Maybe a bit paranoid, but better than the alternative. Have been doing a fair bit of reading about ebike batteries and fires and it seems that overcharging, playing around with the batteries to increase capacity/charge and buying cheap no name batteries off the internet are recipes for disaster.

[Dean2]

Lithium batteries do not like high heat or cold. I have an ebike too. I never charge the battery unless I am present to keep an eye on it. For winter, charge to 80%, store in cool, dry location and keep it away from combustibles if possible. I remove the battery from the bike so it is easier to store away from combustibles. Inspect battery regularly for damage, blistering etc. Any damage, dispose of battery. Make sure the battery you have are CSA or UL certified. Do not use cheap China crap, they are poorly made and therefore more dangerous.

Most of the newer phones like my Samsung S20 and tablets etc give you the ability to have them stop charging at 85%. The lengthens battery life greatly and greatly reduces the risk of overcharging and overheating the battery.

[Scott h]

Originally Posted by funkman

That is very concerning to me that an ebike battery just starts on fire...son has an ebike.

Curious as to how AO members store their ebike batteries during the winter season when not using them. I told him to leave the battery in the detached garage, but he is concerned garage is unheated. Any thoughts?

My batteries are stored on our bikes, in our attached garage. I usually charge them while I'm out in the garage, and then disconnect them before they get to 100% (mostly for battery long term health). Our bikes use Bosch motors and batteries, and I am comfortable with their quality and safety.

[Grizzly Adams1]

Originally Posted by ram crazy

My batteries are stored in a non heated garage and haven't had any issues.

I've been told some parkades prohibit electric cars because of the fire hazard.

[Sundancefisher]

Originally Posted by funkman

That is very concerning to me that an ebike battery just starts on fire...son has an ebike.

Curious as to how AO members store their ebike batteries during the winter season when not using them. I told him to leave the battery in the detached garage, but he is concerned garage is unheated. Any thoughts?

Who would have thunk it.

Apparently battery fires for e-bikes are so common that Amazon sells fire and explosion and heat proof storage and charging bags.

https://www.amazon.ca/s?k=fireproof+...l_22xpsxxkke_b

[Sundancefisher]

Originally Posted by Grizzly Adams1

I've been told some parkades prohibit electric cars because of the fire hazard.

Didn’t even think of that but this was interesting.

https://www.firehouse.com/operations...arking-garages

Fire fighters note the concern.

What even more concerning is that an EV fire can burn hot enough to ignite and offsetting EV and can result in structural building failures.

So every parade in the world is effectively off limits for EV’s… however there are EV’s parking in parkades in Calgary. I’ve seen Tesla’s in the Chinook underground parkade.

[Dean2]

Originally Posted by Sundancefisher

Who would have thunk it.

Apparently battery fires for e-bikes are so common that Amazon sells fire and explosion and heat proof storage and charging bags.

https://www.amazon.ca/s?k=fireproof+...l_22xpsxxkke_b

Thanks for posting that. I did not know they made these. I ordered one, will be here tomorrow from Amazon. Every little bit helps.

[ManitobaSlim]

The other thing you may want to be aware of his how to fight a combustible metal fire. I believe its considered a k class fire and requires very specific fire fighting materials.
If you put water to it it will become significantly worse.

[Sundancefisher]

Originally Posted by ManitobaSlim

The other thing you may want to be aware of his how to fight a combustible metal fire. I believe its considered a k class fire and requires very specific fire fighting materials.
If you put water to it it will become significantly worse.

Apparently if a EV battery fire starts in a parkade, it can ignite offsetting batteries.

An EV battery fire can cause structural collapse of a high rise. Fire is hot enough and big enough to change the structural components of concrete and steal and weaken them.

I never thought that was possible. Then take into account they burn so hot and can’t be dowsed with water… when an EV fire breaks out in a parkade… the fire suppression system will release lots of water.

[freeride]

Originally Posted by ManitobaSlim

The other thing you may want to be aware of his how to fight a combustible metal fire. I believe its considered a k class fire and requires very specific fire fighting materials.
If you put water to it it will become significantly worse.

K class is for cooking fires with oils. Just remember k for kitchen. D is for metals but they are specific fir the typenof metal fire your dealing with.

[freeride]

There was a tesla involved in an accident and sitting in a scrap yard for 3 weeks before the batteries finally broke down enough to catch fire. It took over 4500 gallons of water to put it out. In California I believe.

The problem is they keep the chemical reaction going and igniting again and again. Some fire departments have a sea-can filled with water they basically submerge the car in. You have to fill the entire car up inside to keep the battery under the seat cool.

Normal car fires go out pretty fast, these your grabbing a hydrant. How may hydrants do you see on deerfoot...

[Sundancefisher]

https://driving.ca/column/motor-mout...ectric-vehicle

But it takes 40,000 gallons or over 40 fire engines carrying 1000 gallons of water.

That’s a ton of water for one car fire. 167 ton to be specific.

[Sundog57]

Originally Posted by freeride

K class is for cooking fires with oils. Just remember k for kitchen. D is for metals but they are specific for the type of metal fire your dealing with.

Actually it is "Purple K" dry chem that can be used for putting out Class D fires.
However I don't know if it was intended to put out a mass of combustible material the size of an EV battery.
The scary thing about trying to put out Class D fires with water is that they are often hot enough to break water molecules into hydrogen and oxygen and then use the oxygen to continue burning whereas in most fires there is a combination of exclusion of oxygen through generation of steam combined with cooling.

[freeride]

Originally Posted by Sundog57

Actually it is "Purple K" dry chem that can be used for putting out Class D fires.
However I don't know if it was intended to put out a mass of combustible material the size of an EV battery.
The scary thing about trying to put out Class D fires with water is that they are often hot enough to break water molecules into hydrogen and oxygen and then use the oxygen to continue burning whereas in most fires there is a combination of exclusion of oxygen through generation of steam combined with cooling.

Actually.... Purple k is an extinguishing agent, not a class of fire as described. Big difference.

If you read what I was correcting... manitobaslim just had the CLASS of fire mixed up. Nothing to do with purple k, he just thought a metal fire was a CLASS K, not the correct CLASS D.

[Dean2]

Originally Posted by freeride

Actually.... Purple k is an extinguishing agent, not a class of fire as described. Big difference.

So enough of how many angels can dance on the head of a pin. Is there a way to put out a battery fire with an extinquisher? and if there is what exactly what type of extinguisher do we have to buy. It is a lot more useful to provide solutions than criticism of someone elses imperfect knowledge.

[npbra]

The Purple K fire extinguisher contains specially fluidized and siliconized potassium bicarbonate dry chemical which is particularly effective on Class B flammable liquids and pressurized gases. It is electrically non-conductive. PURPLE K fire extinguishers have been the choice of oil, gas, chemical and utilities industries as the preferred fire-fighting agent.

Class D fire extinguishers are specifically designed chemicals for specific usage against specific fires. Hope this corrects the wrong info on this thread.

[freeride]

Originally Posted by Dean2

So enough of how many angels can dance on the head of a pin. Is there a way to put out a battery fire with an extinquisher? and if there is what exactly what type of extinguisher do we have to buy. It is a lot more useful to provide solutions than criticism of someone elses imperfect knowledge.

No criticism here, just trying to clear up some misinformation.


Hopefully npbra's post as well clears it up.

[Phil McCracken]

So our Greenpeace Liberal Activist Guibeault is pushing all this EV stuff.

Wonder why he is not pushing this valuable information shared by the members here???

And Thanx for the OP for sharing this...

[Rock Doctor]

Flying on planes makes me wonder. Do airlines scan all luggage for lithium batteries in their cargo holds and do people buy the protective carry bags for the batteries?[/QUOTE]

No and no.
Lithium batteries are supposed to go in your carry on bag, but they don't seem to check to make sure.

My daughter just brought a drone to me, she flew domestic and international. She had drone in carry on bag. They checked drone through security, but never asked about batteries. Daughter did not know rules and had batteries in checked bag. Nobody asked about batteries.

RD

[fishtank]

Opening a new can of worms …. Insurance is going through the roof .

[Sundancefisher]

https://youtu.be/5r-yN8SugWM?feature=shared

That escalated quickly

[barbless]

This can't be the first time we have heard about this. EV batteries catching fire
It is good though some are offering ways to maybe safely store them and a way to put them out.

[birdhound]

Have heard that the IDLH zone from an EV fire is pretty big as well. Dont recall the number exactly but want to say around 100 feet. The fumes released might be worse than the extreme heat and damage caused if in a parkade or your garage

[fishnguy]

Admittedly, I didn’t read most of the thread, but I want to chime in because why not, haha.

So I have a dozen or so lithium ion batteries in my house. And so does my neighbour. And the one on the other side. And others all around as well. In the past decade, I have had many more. And so did my neighbours, as well as gazillion other people around the world. I had one swell up (wife's phone, lost some very valuable photos, unfortunately).

Anyway, sounds like the killer bees are coming. Granted, I never looked into any of it, but sounds like the bees sure are coming.

[HyperMOA]

Originally Posted by fishnguy

Admittedly, I didn’t read most of the thread, but I want to chime in because why not, haha.

So I have a dozen or so lithium ion batteries in my house. And so does my neighbour. And the one on the other side. And others all around as well. In the past decade, I have had many more. And so did my neighbours, as well as gazillion other people around the world. I had one swell up (wife's phone, lost some very valuable photos, unfortunately).

Anyway, sounds like the killer bees are coming. Granted, I never looked into any of it, but sounds like the bees sure are coming.

Yes we all do have batteries. My buddies tools started his garage on fire and burned the house down. A buddy at work had his laptop start his welding truck on fire which burned down the entire welding shop. It happens. I don’t leave my milwaukee or other batteries charging without being around.

[fishnguy]

Originally Posted by HyperMOA

Yes we all do have batteries. My buddies tools started his garage on fire and burned the house down. A buddy at work had his laptop start his welding truck on fire which burned down the entire welding shop. It happens. I don’t leave my milwaukee or other batteries charging without being around.

Certain amount of caution is certainly warranted (just like with them bees?), but there sure seems to have been a lot of “omg, the batteries!” lately.

About 20 years ago, a plugged in electronic alarm clock in parents’ bedroom went in flames all of a sudden and started a fire. Was a fine clock, worked for years, nothing wrong with it. Luckily, I was home and felt the smoke and put the fire out.

[Albertadiver]

I was on a jobsite last fall. A worker dropped a lithium battery from a cordless drill off a ladder on the 20th floor and it exploded. Flames torched the ceiling and the site had to be evacuated. Those batteries are ticking time bombs if not handled properly.