300 Win Mag vs. 300 Weatherby Mag

[Mike_W]

I currently own a 300 Win Mag that I would like to semi retire as it has sentental value and I want to keep it in good condition (wet conditions in moose and elk camp can make this hard).

Anyway I'm looking for a moose and elk gun that I can abuse without feeling bad about it.

The question isn't which one will kill an elk deader but what's everyone's thoughts. ( Recoil, performance, overkill ect. any comments are welcome.
I hand load and have heard great things about the weatherby's and to be honest I just want a 300 Weatherby mag but the 300 win mag has treated me good over the years.

Thanks
Mike

[Pathfinder76]

The 300 Wby is an excellent round. I might also look at the 7MM magnums. A stainless Ruger 77 in 7MM Rem Mag would be tough to beat.

Re the "old" 300. Pick up the latest issue of Sports Afield (the 125th anniversary issue). It has an article on a pair of 375 1949 and 50 Model 70's that have been exposed to as harsh of conditions imaginable. They never failed to function and one is still being used in Alaska.

You won't ruin your rifle by using it.

[sns2]

i would think the biggest difference is cost of brass.

[Lefty-Canuck]

Originally Posted by sns2

i would think the biggest difference is cost of brass.

Actually of all of the WBY cartridges....300WBY is likely the cheapest one both from the aspect of factory ammo and brass. Depending on the choice of bullets you can find .300WBY factory ammo for around $40. I personally use Hornady brass which goes for about $60 /50 if I recall....might be cheaper than that.

LC

[Mike_W]

I should mention the gun I am looking at comes in a 24 inch barrel only.

[bulletman]

I prefer the .300 Win.Mag. Cost of ammo is quite a bit cheaper. A bag of .300 Win.MAG IS 40 BUCKS but you only get a box of 20 for that in the Weatherby. Selection of .300 Win.Mag. is very impressive. Get a stainless model rifle. On game performance is impressive with either one!

[cowmanbob]

Why not go with a 300wsm?

[elkhunter11]

I have owned the 300win mag, the 300WBY, and the 300RUM. My own personal favorite was the 300RUM, but to be honest, I would recommend the 300winmag over the 300WBY, or the 300RUM. The 300winmag produces less recoil, and even it is more than many people can shoot comfortably. If I was going to bother with either the WBY, or the RUM, I would go with a 26" barrel, to make better use of the extra case capacity.

[Lefty-Canuck]

I agree if the rifle you are looking at only has a 24inch barrel...go with the .300 Win Mag, to get the full gains of the other choices you would want a 26 inch barrel.

LC

[Ranger CS]

The difference between the .300 Win. and the .300 Weatherby mags is ballistically very academic and at the end of day does not mean allot. If you want to increase your edge consider the .338 Win. Mag. The recoil is not significantly more for a serious Big Game hunting rifle. I describe the recoil as being slower with a big push, and not as quick and sharp as some other calibers.

[Andrzej]

I am loading for friends Sako 75 SS in 300 Weatherby Magnum for last 10 years or so and he is shooting one bullet only for everything 180 TSX at 3180 ft/sec ( flat trajectory). It is braked rifle and his skinny 14 y old Son is sharing this gun with Father since 12 y old.

I am shooting Sako 75 Finnlight in 300 Win Mag with brake and 180 TTSX at 3000 ft/sec.
I would recommend this one since it is lighter rifle and better for hunting Elk on foot.

Other friend has Tikka T3 Lite SS in 300 WSM and it is gun that has hardest felt recoil from them all despite Limbsaver pad installed.

Get gun that fits you well. SS put good scope and use for everything (like my first friend)

[bdub]

I have been hunting with a .300 Wtby as my main hunting rifle for quite a while. I guess it is a step up from the .300 Win, like stepping up from a 30-06 to a 300 Win. Just depends how much you want that extra 100-200 fps I guess. Brass and loaded ammo could be an issue as well as barrel life. You get a much longer case neck on the Wtby. I really like it with the heavier bullets, you can push the 200s in the Wtby at about the same speed as 180s in the Win mag. As for barrel length I would stay with the 24 rather than the 26 for hunting for myself. I had a .340 with a 26 and it was a pain in the but for my style of hunting so I got rid of it. Choices, choices.

[ShawnM]

I'll chime in with a vote for .300WinMag. I've had two rifles now in .300WM and love the caliber. My current is a Ruger 77 MkII in stainless with a laminated stock. Looks sharp as a razor and shoots very well.

I like the cartridge for a number of reasons:

1) Even though I handload I could still have an 80% chance of finding factory ammo in a gas station or Canadian Tire
2) The performance has only been beaten by cartridges with much higher recoil and in most cases they are only marginal improvements
3) There is load data for it everywhere, it's so common and every powder manufacturer lists good load data for it
4) There's tons of used ones for sale that were bought by people that thought they could shoot the .300WM but decided they like their shoulders a little less purple at the end of a day at the range
5) Reloading components cost very little, especially compared to Weatherby brass, you can pick up used dies, shell holders, brass, etc. for next to nothing
6) It's a milspec cartridge so you can get SP rifles chambered in .300WM if that's your taste

The list goes on but at the end of the day the Weatherby cartridges are excellent, there's no debate there, but unless you're hot on a Weatherby rifle for some reason there's no point in considering that cartridge.

[Leeper]

I have built and shot rifles in most of the 30 caliber magnums and all have performed well. Good accuracy is easily obtainable with all of them.
From a performance standpoint, there is not a great deal to choose between them if one is handloading. Using 180 grain bullets, the following velocities are realistic and reachable at reasonable pressures:
300 H&H- the 300 H&H will achieve 3000 fps with a 180 in the 26 inch barrels normally used in this caliber.
308 Norma-- Just under 3100 is easily accomplished.
300 Winchester- Just over 3100 up to 3150 is a reasonable expectation from a 300 Win mag. Performance and versatility is enhanced by chambering the rifle with a bit longer throat if the magazine is long enough to allow it. The new Model 70's are throated longer which accounts for the relatively low velocities obtained from factory ammunition (longer throat = lower pressures= lower velocities with the same load).
300 Weatherby-- 3180 to 3200 from a 26 inch barrel is pretty common
300 RUM--- 3250 is a realistic maximum.
As you can see, there is not a whole lot of difference between the 300 Win Mag and the Weatherby when both are loaded to similar pressures. I like the weatherby though for a couple of reasons. First, the longer neck gives you a lot more latitude in bullet choice and bullet seating depth. Second, if the magazine is long enough to accept the Weatherby, there is little reason not to have it.
As far as brass is concerned, one can buy weatherby brass, Remington brass, or you can fireform 300 H&H brass. You can rasily burn out a barrel with 50 rounds of brass so I don't consider it to be a big deal. Factory ammunition availability favors the Winchester by a bit although Weatherby ammo is often stocked in some pretty unusual geographic locations.
The one thing which has always bugged me about the 300 Win Mag is that it was designed with that stupid, ultra-short neck. The cartridge was designed by Winchester's sales staff to be physically larger than the 308 Norma because it was felt that was necessary to give it an edge over the already-established Norma offering in the marketplace. Cartridges are probably better when designed by ballisticians rather than sales executives.
By the way, the WSM performs about the same as a 300 H&H but does it using a cartridge design which is almost totally devoid of class! That it continues to flourish is testament to the effect of a well designed ad campaign and not a well designed cartridge. Winchester had some experience with this though with the 300 Winchester and it worked in both cases. Leeper

[Mike_W]

Originally Posted by Leeper

I have built and shot rifles in most of the 30 caliber magnums and all have performed well. Good accuracy is easily obtainable with all of them.
From a performance standpoint, there is not a great deal to choose between them if one is handloading. Using 180 grain bullets, the following velocities are realistic and reachable at reasonable pressures:
300 H&H- the 300 H&H will achieve 3000 fps with a 180 in the 26 inch barrels normally used in this caliber.
308 Norma-- Just under 3100 is easily accomplished.
300 Winchester- Just over 3100 up to 3150 is a reasonable expectation from a 300 Win mag. Performance and versatility is enhanced by chambering the rifle with a bit longer throat if the magazine is long enough to allow it. The new Model 70's are throated longer which accounts for the relatively low velocities obtained from factory ammunition (longer throat = lower pressures= lower velocities with the same load).
300 Weatherby-- 3180 to 3200 from a 26 inch barrel is pretty common
300 RUM--- 3250 is a realistic maximum.
As you can see, there is not a whole lot of difference between the 300 Win Mag and the Weatherby when both are loaded to similar pressures. I like the weatherby though for a couple of reasons. First, the longer neck gives you a lot more latitude in bullet choice and bullet seating depth. Second, if the magazine is long enough to accept the Weatherby, there is little reason not to have it.
As far as brass is concerned, one can buy weatherby brass, Remington brass, or you can fireform 300 H&H brass. You can rasily burn out a barrel with 50 rounds of brass so I don't consider it to be a big deal. Factory ammunition availability favors the Winchester by a bit although Weatherby ammo is often stocked in some pretty unusual geographic locations.
The one thing which has always bugged me about the 300 Win Mag is that it was designed with that stupid, ultra-short neck. The cartridge was designed by Winchester's sales staff to be physically larger than the 308 Norma because it was felt that was necessary to give it an edge over the already-established Norma offering in the marketplace. Cartridges are probably better when designed by ballisticians rather than sales executives.
By the way, the WSM performs about the same as a 300 H&H but does it using a cartridge design which is almost totally devoid of class! That it continues to flourish is testament to the effect of a well designed ad campaign and not a well designed cartridge. Winchester had some experience with this though with the 300 Winchester and it worked in both cases. Leeper

All good info and thanks for that, but do you like the 300 win or 300 weatherby?
How does case neck length affect a cartridges performance?

It appears that with the barrel length I might as well stick with a cartridge that I am famiar with and that has treated me well!!

Thanks,
Mike

[bdub]

Case neck length gives you more latitude in bullet seating depth with shorter/lighter bullets. If your gun likes bullets close to the lands then you have more neck to play with in the Wtby case with lighter bullets. I believe that is what Leeper was getting at.

[addictedfisherman]

The longer neck will allow you to seat bullets farther out (rifle dependent) which can help with accuracy. Its very Noticeable with berger bullets lol
I've shot both and I ended up with the Weatherby.
It doesn't kill any better and to be honest 98% of guys cant shoot to the potential of the cartridge anyway. So in the end it doesn't really matter. Either 300 will lay a whoopin on whatever you shoot(provided you do your part)
The Weatherby just does it with a little bit more punch.

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by Leeper

The one thing which has always bugged me about the 300 Win Mag is that it was designed with that stupid, ultra-short neck. The cartridge was designed by Winchester's sales staff to be physically larger than the 308 Norma because it was felt that was necessary to give it an edge over the already-established Norma offering in the marketplace. Cartridges are probably better when designed by ballisticians rather than sales executives.
By the way, the WSM performs about the same as a 300 H&H but does it using a cartridge design which is almost totally devoid of class! That it continues to flourish is testament to the effect of a well designed ad campaign and not a well designed cartridge. Winchester had some experience with this though with the 300 Winchester and it worked in both cases. Leeper

Yup, somebody designing something to sell to someone that thinks they need it!
Cat

[silver]

Originally Posted by catnthehat

Yup, somebody designing something to sell to someone that thinks they need it!
Cat

I guess, in my opinion, that covers most of the new cartridges

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by silver

I guess, in my opinion, that covers most of the new cartridges

Many do not need to be here , that is for sure, but then things would be boring around here, wouldn't they??!!
Ddad told me that when I was just a young lad!
Cat

[kennedy]

Why not the 300 WSM? More efficient and less recoil.

[elnino54]

Mike, I had a Sako75 SS in a 300 Wthby that I just sold. I really liked it, but because I'm so short, it was just too long for me with the 26" barrel. my buddies always laughed at me because I looked like I was carrying a musket.

Ammo can be a little pricey, but you can get a pretty good variety. I've taken everything with that gun, Moose, Elk, Deer, Wolf and even Antelope with a 130 gr TTSX smoking out of the barrel at about 3650 fps. It's been less than a year since I sold it, and I do miss it already, although it was the right thing to do. I am thinking about replacing it, but just don't know what to get.....

Craig

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by kennedy

Why not the 300 WSM? More efficient and less recoil.

The amount of efficinecy and less recoil is not enough to warrant it in a hunting situation.
The biggest draw is said to be that , and the fact that it can fit in a shorter action - by 1/4" or something like that.
I've owned a few of them and also several wildcats on the WSM case, and althoughb they are fun and great cartridges, I found them no more accurate than any of the other magnums .
I really believe through my experience that if the rifle is well made , it makes no difference in the cartridge in a certqain groupinf , ie. .30 or 7 magnum types.
if the rifle is not well made it also is the biggest difference.
Cat

[ShawnM]

Originally Posted by catnthehat

if the rifle is not well made it also is the biggest difference.
Cat

Very true, the rifle has to be quality in order to shoot well. And the shooter has to be ready to accept the recoil that a .308 bullet in a magnum case will dish out. An awful lot of people feel that they can "handle" the recoil from the magnum cases but in truth it shows in their shooting. If you've ever seen someone's rifle jump at the range with no accompanying report then you've seen what a magnum can train into some people. (Not saying that's the case with the OP just speaking to general experience.)

At the end of the day a magnum cartridge is just about gaining latitude in terms of velocity and effective distance, which for most shooters shouldn't really be a consideration.

[Mike_W]

Originally Posted by kennedy

Why not the 300 WSM? More efficient and less recoil.

I have had a 300 wsm and didn't like the cartridge it's too short to load mono metal bullets and restricts me in reloading ballisticly it offered no advantage over the 300 win mag.
Also the gun I am looking at isn't avalible in short mag configurations.

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by Mike_W

I have had a 300 wsm and didn't like the cartridge it's too short to load mono metal bullets and restricts me in reloading ballisticly it offered no advantage over the 300 win mag.
Also the gun I am looking at isn't avalible in short mag configurations.

To use the long bullets , you pretty much need to get a cutom chamber.
We often use the 300WSM with longer bullets of 200grains or better in 1,000match shooting,but like you staed Mike, for a hunting rifle , the longer bullets often don't work ewell with the rifles the 300WSM is chambered in.
Cat

[Saul Goode]

Sometimes ya gotta go with your heart and not your head. If your thinkin 300 bee then get it; regardless of barrel length; cost/availibility etc.of ammo. hate to see you buy a win mag and wish it was a bee mag. Just my .02cents, you wont lose with either one.

[DEZ]

I own a 300Win mag in a BSA and a 300Ultra in a Rem Sendero I like the 300 with 168gr Bergers and 185Bergers in the Ultra I picked up the old BSA locally for 395.00 with a scope the action has been bedded and barrel is free floating the gun shoots sub moa. what more could I ask for. 300 win mag is my personal favorite Cal. I have owned 4 different rifles in 300win mag over the years they all shot well I could never spend the extra just for the weatherby name but thats just me

[GWN]

Originally Posted by Mike_W

I hand load and have heard great things about the weatherby's and to be honest I just want a 300 Weatherby mag but the 300 win mag has treated me good over the years.

Thanks
Mike

If that's the one you want then just get it.

I'm considering getting a 300 Weatherby as well, not because I need it but because I want it, there's just something about that cartridge.......

I am looking at the Mark V Euromark, which model are you thinking of?

[Ice Fishing Maniac]

Seen a used Sako m75ss 300WBY for sale not too long ago...was tempted but passed.

I dont think you will find any Weatherby caliber barrel under 26" on a factory -barreled rifle, but I have been wrong before.