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08-03-2013, 10:03 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Red Deer
Posts: 487
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calgary Dave
Excellent post...except for one teensy detail....I fixed it for you. It wasn't "Mantracker, Terry Grant".
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Lol, thanks. My bad
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08-03-2013, 10:39 AM
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: The elbow of Alberta
Posts: 1,363
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When you use a vehicle as a weapon chances are you will be shot. I hope Curtis gets his life back in order and recovers fully for his families sake and am glad non of the officers were hurt as well.
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08-03-2013, 11:31 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Whitecourt
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Any of you great brains ever think that Curtis' "renegade" past may have been exaggerated for the show? Nah, tv shows wouldn't do that.
Terry mentioned it in an interview on one of the seasons.
And to those of you saying cooperate with the cops or risk getting shot, really? So Johnny Law comes round looking for info/witnesses and I don't cooperate cause I don't wanna get involved I run the risk of getting shot?
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08-03-2013, 11:35 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Beaumont
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Wow, lots of speculation going on and huge inferences being drawn. So many that I don't even no where to begin. 
First and foremost, as it was NOT Mantracker that was shot.
Second would be that the accused was stopped for suspicion of drunk driving. FishingMom is quick to judge without facts that he WAS impaired and "fighting with police" (sorry to burst your bubble but it never said he fought with police) and yes he did flee from the cops (after being shot multiple times  ). Neither in most cases should warrant the use of deadly force. Flame suit on. 
People are also assuming that he used his vehicle as a weapon?? Guess I missed that part of the story too.
It would be nice to let some of the "facts" or at least more news reports come out so we could make more informed decisions before we judge either the accused or the cops.
__________________
The kill is the satisfying, indeed essential, conclusion to a successful hunt. But, I take no pleasure in the act itself. One does not hunt in order to kill, but kills in order to have hunted. Then why do I hunt? I hunt for the same reason my well-fed cat hunts...because I must, because it is in the blood, because I am the decendent of a thousand generations of hunters. I hunt because I am a hunter.- Finn Aagard
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08-03-2013, 11:45 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Beaumont
Posts: 3,389
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brownbomber
You're a big dude some Guys might like to try their chances just so they can say that they took on the hugest cop ever. Smaller chick cop same guys attitude may be "yes ma'm I will get in the car"
I have been in that boat for some reason more than a few times in bars and such big enough that hey I fought this big guy and did ok but not big enough to completely discourage random acts of stupidity. That's drunken fool attitude right.
But back to the point you were making. "Sucking chest wound" yeah that seems to be prevelant.
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BB you're what I'd call a tweener. In football it was guys that were too big to play LB and a little too small for the defensive line. Usually the term was reserved for guys that were big but not giants. When I worked in bars it was a term used for doorman and bouncers too.
One of the toughest guys I know was a "tweener" a big guy at 6 - 6'1" and 210lbs of as solid muscle as guy can get but because he wasn't a pro wrestling giant guys would always try and "test themselves" against him. It NEVER went well for them, in fact he was a guy who never lost a fight or even used more than one punch. He had the genetics to be a Roy Jones Jr. type of fighter and in fact his brother was a Commonwealth games bronze medalist as a cruiser weight and he could wipe the floor with him. Sorry for the derail.
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The kill is the satisfying, indeed essential, conclusion to a successful hunt. But, I take no pleasure in the act itself. One does not hunt in order to kill, but kills in order to have hunted. Then why do I hunt? I hunt for the same reason my well-fed cat hunts...because I must, because it is in the blood, because I am the decendent of a thousand generations of hunters. I hunt because I am a hunter.- Finn Aagard
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08-03-2013, 11:55 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Calgary
Posts: 4,962
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zuludog
Wow, lots of speculation going on and huge inferences being drawn. So many that I don't even know where to begin. |
Very true....I'll play as well:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zuludog
First and foremost, as it was NOT Mantracker that was shot.
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I think that's been already well established in the thread:
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Originally Posted by leeaspell
Got names confused, need to re-read
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lone_Wolf
.....Curtis's skills in the woods were due in part to time he spent running from the law. If true he was a renegade. Interesting to see what happens with this story.
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Quote:
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The news report said the sister hasn't even really had a chance to talk to man tracker's sidekick, Curtis Hallock, all this report says is what the sister knows. And that doesn't seem to be much at this point. She says he was unarmed, but maybe he managed to get a hold of one of the RC's guns? Prompting a retaliatory shooting from the other RCMP officer. There's definitely not enough info in that article to make ANY educated assumptions. For now, all we can do is wait and see how it all pans out. After the full story comes out, then everyone can flame either mantracker's sidekick, Curtis Hallock, or the cops.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calgary Dave
....It wasn't "Mantracker, Terry Grant".
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Carrying on.....
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zuludog
Second would be that the accused was stopped for suspicion of drunk driving. FishingMom is quick to judge without facts that he WAS impaired and "fighting with police" (sorry to burst your bubble but it never said he fought with police)
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Semantics. When I read
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...a confrontation started that led to Hollock being shot by the officers.
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...then I take that to mean he "fought". However you want to define "fought" vs "confrontation"
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Originally Posted by Zuludog
and yes he did flee from the cops (after being shot multiple times ). Neither in most cases should warrant the use of deadly force. Flame suit on. |
Again, it seems YOU are the one jumping to a conclusion. Curtis could have "fought and reached for a gun"....or he could have quietly been sitting in his car and gunned down by trigger happy cops....no one knows. YET.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zuludog
People are also assuming that he used his vehicle as a weapon?? Guess I missed that part of the story too.
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Couldn't agree more. Happens all the time on AO...someone paints a scenario, that soon becomes "fact".
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zuludog
It would be nice to let some of the "facts" or at least more news reports come out so we could make more informed decisions before we judge either the accused or the cops.
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^^ Best post of the thread.
/thread.
Last edited by Clgy_Dave2.0; 08-03-2013 at 12:04 PM.
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08-03-2013, 12:16 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zuludog
Wow, lots of speculation going on and huge inferences being drawn. So many that I don't even no where to begin.
First and foremost, as it was NOT Mantracker that was shot.
Second would be that the accused was stopped for suspicion of drunk driving. FishingMom is quick to judge without facts that he WAS impaired and "fighting with police" (sorry to burst your bubble but it never said he fought with police) and yes he did flee from the cops (after being shot multiple times ). Neither in most cases should warrant the use of deadly force. Flame suit on.
People are also assuming that he used his vehicle as a weapon?? Guess I missed that part of the story too.
It would be nice to let some of the "facts" or at least more news reports come out so we could make more informed decisions before we judge either the accused or the cops. |
Let the facts come out? you mean their could possibly be a different outcome then what the folks of AO have assumed? LOL
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08-03-2013, 12:22 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Sherwood Park Ab
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Quote:
Originally Posted by .35
Let the facts come out? you mean their could possibly be a different outcome then what the folks of AO have assumed? LOL
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Gossip queens.....
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An awful lot of big game was killed with the .30-06 including the big bears before everyone became affluent enough to own a rifle for every species of game they might hunt.
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08-03-2013, 12:29 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Beaumont
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Dave, you are the quote master. lol I wish I could format my response like you did but am at this time not forum savy enough.
Yes, it was already established that it wasn't Terry Grant but I wanted to start a little non-confrontational and build from there. So, my first point was moot and didn't single anyone out. lol
I think both "fighting" and "being confrontational" can be physical but you can definitely be confrontational without having a physical fight. People have disputes all the time, without it resorting to violence. If people are using the terms as synonyms and to justify (deadly) force than they're referring to a physical confrontation. If it was a physical confrontation or fight I think it would've been reported as such?
He could've been shot before or while fleeing I guess. The latter of course makes the RCMP look bad or worse depending upon your opinion. I did assume he was shot then fled and assumed he wasn't shot while running away
__________________
The kill is the satisfying, indeed essential, conclusion to a successful hunt. But, I take no pleasure in the act itself. One does not hunt in order to kill, but kills in order to have hunted. Then why do I hunt? I hunt for the same reason my well-fed cat hunts...because I must, because it is in the blood, because I am the decendent of a thousand generations of hunters. I hunt because I am a hunter.- Finn Aagard
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08-03-2013, 12:30 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 7,350
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sundancefisher
Near as I read it says 2 shots hit him. Sounds like a case of trying to run down a cop in a car while drunk.
Time will tell.
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Very possible, and wouldn't be the first time. Have had a few officer fatalities that way.
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eat a snickers
made in Alberta__ born n raised.
FS-Tinfool hats by the roll. 
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08-03-2013, 12:31 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 7,350
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raab
Here's a novel concept, cooperate with the police and you won't get shot period.
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this^^^^^
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eat a snickers
made in Alberta__ born n raised.
FS-Tinfool hats by the roll.
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08-03-2013, 12:32 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 7,350
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 58thecat
I will tell ya whats going on pure speculation...so sit back and watch the experts opinions pop up...better than any soap opera 
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Agree!
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eat a snickers
made in Alberta__ born n raised.
FS-Tinfool hats by the roll.
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08-03-2013, 12:43 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Communist Capital of Alberta
Posts: 3,771
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 6.5swedeforelk
"Pump 2-3 slugs into him before the clock starts & you don't even work up a sweat!"
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I really don't care how this turns out anymore, this is the funniest post in the whole thread!
Hopefully the Quote Police approve.
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08-03-2013, 01:53 PM
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Location: Just North of the 55th Parallel
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It's a slippery slope when the public support members of the force to play judge, jury and executioner, especially when all the facts haven't been presented yet. Even if Curtis was drunk, started a confrontation then ran, this still isn't a reason to shoot. Seems as though the police aren't very well trained these days. Why wasn't he tazered? Two officers couldn't subdue one suspect? There is nothing that Curtis did that warranted getting shot for, especially if he was running away. Obviously the two officers weren't in any imminent danger. We've got trigger happy people supporting trigger happy police. Scary.
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08-03-2013, 01:59 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 15,847
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raab
Here's a novel concept, cooperate with the police and you won't get shot period.
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You might still. Or end up with vibram in your mouth.
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08-03-2013, 02:01 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Red Deer
Posts: 487
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sporty
It's a slippery slope when the public support members of the force to play judge, jury and executioner, especially when all the facts haven't been presented yet. Even if Curtis was drunk, started a confrontation then ran, this still isn't a reason to shoot. Seems as though the police aren't very well trained these days. Why wasn't he tazered? Two officers couldn't subdue one suspect? There is nothing that Curtis did that warranted getting shot for, especially if he was running away. Obviously the two officers weren't in any imminent danger. We've got trigger happy people supporting trigger happy police. Scary.
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Aren't you jumping the gun a bit here? So far, nobody knows what Curtis did or didn't do yet. I agree that a tazer should be used before a gun is but maybe this situation warranted the use of deadly force. Or maybe the police did screw up and shot him needlessly 3 times. The point is, nobody knows what actually happened yet. So nobody should be placing blame on anybody until they have all the facts.
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08-03-2013, 02:10 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Calgary
Posts: 4,962
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sporty
It's a slippery slope when the public support members of the force to play judge, jury and executioner, especially when all the facts haven't been presented yet. Even if Curtis was drunk, started a confrontation then ran, this still isn't a reason to shoot. Seems as though the police aren't very well trained these days. Why wasn't he tazered? Two officers couldn't subdue one suspect? There is nothing that Curtis did that warranted getting shot for, especially if he was running away. Obviously the two officers weren't in any imminent danger. We've got trigger happy people supporting trigger happy police. Scary.
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They weren't?!! Oh whew. Thank god you cleared that up. I guess you know that from being right there and witnessing the whole encounter. 
Just as you chastise the "public support members of the public" for jumping to the conclusion that police WERE justified in their actions...what's the difference between that and YOUR statement of "fact" that they were in no danger?!?
So what if....just what IF, Curtis DID try to run them down with his car? Would they have been justified? What IF he DID try grabbing for their gun and turn it on them...?
You're being "judge and jury" yourself, coming up with a verdict based on your own personal opinion.
Scary.
Last edited by Clgy_Dave2.0; 08-03-2013 at 02:16 PM.
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08-03-2013, 02:22 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huntsfurfish
this^^^^^
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Anybody that believes in that analogy deserves to live in a big field and be ruled by a shepard.
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08-03-2013, 02:23 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Red Deer
Posts: 4,998
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuck
You might still. Or end up with vibram in your mouth.
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Just ask Buddy Tavares.
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I'm not saying I'm the man, but it's been said.
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08-03-2013, 02:35 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Quesnel BC Canada
Posts: 5,603
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calgary Dave
They weren't?!! Oh whew. Thank god you cleared that up. I guess you know that from being right there and witnessing the whole encounter.
Just as you chastise the "public support members of the public" for jumping to the conclusion that police WERE justified in their actions...what's the difference between that and YOUR statement of "fact" that they were in no danger?!?
So what if....just what IF, Curtis DID try to run them down with his car? Would they have been justified? What IF he DID try grabbing for their gun and turn it on them...?
You're being "judge and jury" yourself, coming up with a verdict based on your own personal opinion.
Scary. |
What if...he got shot because he's NDN?? Can't blame him for running after being shot twice...you'd be awful dumb to stand around and wait for a kill shot eh?? 
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08-03-2013, 02:47 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: The elbow of Alberta
Posts: 1,363
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanuckShooter
What if...he got shot because he's NDN?? Can't blame him for running after being shot twice...you'd be awful dumb to stand around and wait for a kill shot eh?? |
Ahh Man please don't pull that card. We have a great native community around here and I have a lot of respect for them. They are very prosperous and are involved through out the community and it's industries. What it comes down is one bad decision that could have ended a lot worse.
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08-03-2013, 02:50 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Calgary Perchdance
Posts: 18,890
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanuckShooter
What if...he got shot because he's NDN?? Can't blame him for running after being shot twice...you'd be awful dumb to stand around and wait for a kill shot eh?? |
We need to write a AOF blog book. With all the great creative minds on threads like this it should be a great selling fiction novel.
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It is not the most intellectual of the species that survives; it is not the strongest that survives; but the species that survives is the one that is able best to adapt and adjust to the changing environment in which it finds itself. Charles Darwin
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08-03-2013, 03:29 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Quesnel BC Canada
Posts: 5,603
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Wing
Ahh Man please don't pull that card. We have a great native community around here and I have a lot of respect for them. They are very prosperous and are involved through out the community and it's industries. What it comes down is one bad decision that could have ended a lot worse.
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Just adding in my own speculation. With all the other fact-less speculation on this thread why not throw it out there?? Everyone knows that at times the police have been less than stellar in their approach to natives. example: dropping them outside of Saskatoon in -40
It would be interesting to hear what actually went down, how do they manage to get into the position to wound someone and have them run away??
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08-03-2013, 04:26 PM
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I heard that he tried to hit one of the Officers with his car!
His car in this instance, would be considered a weapon. A weapon that could make an Officer fear for his safety, or the safety of others.....which would justify the use of a firearm.
If this is indeed what transpired, I see no wrongdoing from the Officer's involved and in fact, I applaud them for their actions.
BUT, to be honest, none of us will actually know what transpired until the report comes out.
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08-03-2013, 04:30 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 7,350
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheRealDeal
Anybody that believes in that analogy deserves to live in a big field and be ruled by a shepard.
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lol
So no laws would suit you?
And there is a hospital ward for tin hatters you know.
__________________
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eat a snickers
made in Alberta__ born n raised.
FS-Tinfool hats by the roll.
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08-03-2013, 04:49 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 12,558
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deanmc
No I still would not assume to know whats right based on initial news reports.
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I agree.
It is too early to know...so I'm giving the cops the benefit of the doubt this time...for now.
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08-03-2013, 07:48 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: K'nadia, 'merica
Posts: 2,362
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raab
Here's a novel concept, cooperate with the police and you won't get shot period.
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Screw that. Police are not perfect... There are many examples.
"know your rights, act accordingly, video everything"
__________________
Interests: Things that go Zoom, and things that go Boom.
'You can't fix stupid, but for a hundred bucks an hour, we sure can diagnose it"
Pay It Forward.. In Memory of Rob Hanson
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08-03-2013, 08:30 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Sydney Nova Scotia
Posts: 797
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As Old kernel Klink Would Say Very Interesting But Hey still 1 road in and out of Grande Cache sheeesh
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Just My Opinion
Steve In GP
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08-03-2013, 09:12 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huntsfurfish
lol
So no laws would suit you?
And there is a hospital ward for tin hatters you know.
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NoI didnt say that.
If we dont question authority and always remember that the government is supposed to be chosen by us to represent us we are doomed to end up in a police state.
Dont ever assume that just cuz a cop says so hes right.
Not saying this particular incident is necessarily a good example of that either cuz like the rest of you all I have to work with is the information the cops gave to the media and who knows how accurate thats gonna be.
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