The Christmas the police never came.

[FishingMOM]

Originally Posted by GunnerySgtJackson

http://www.newspapers.com/newspage/50021432/

that link takes you to a pay per view site

[backpacker]

Originally Posted by brslk

Actually no. I see some attached thumb nails that aren't conclusive at all.

So you can't see the date on the top of the page of the second thumbnail? There will always be sceptics, myself I can read and from what I see there was a newspaper that covered this story just as the OP has suggested it happened.

[Big Daddy Badger]

To be honest... and giving the OP some credit here... has he considered that he is likely the victim of a hoax?

He was probably talking to someone on a CB that didn't want the search called off for weather or a sicko playing games.
Happens all the time.

Look how many people got calls from people inside the twin towers.
How many of those calls actually happened or were someone playing games?

All of em IIRC.

The odds are just too long...especially when one considers that the black box was apparently making noise? The radio conflicts?

C'mon... either he got trolled 30 years ago or we are being trolled today.

[CNP]

Originally Posted by FishingMOM

that link takes you to a pay per view site

From that site:

EDMONTON (CP) The sighting of a flare In the British Columbia interior has given new hope that four people aboard a missing plane might be found alive, a armed forces spokesman said today. Maj. Vic Keating said RCMP on horseback and snowmobiles have been searching near Lac la Hache where the flare was seen Tuesday. Four residents of Indian Head, Sask, were on a flight to Kamloops, B.C., from Red Deer, Alta., when their plane went missing Sunday. Maj. Keating said the armed forces would resume an air search today. Aboard the Cessna 185 were pilot Art Underwood, Chet Talbot, 60, Talbot's wife Betty, 47, and their son

[MrDave]

So far I haven't found any follow up articles. Going to see if I can find a local paper from their home area. Goin to be a tough one. Some communities have better libraries. But will see. Damn pre digital age. Haven't found the air company. Might not have survived this. Give me time. Lol

Found a link on here for region maps. Going to look at that. Any surveyors on here with a file full of aerials? I know there were some on here before. Still?? Maybe not.

[GunnerySgtJackson]

Originally Posted by MrDave

So far I haven't found any follow up articles. Going to see if I can find a local paper from their home area. Goin to be a tough one. Some communities have better libraries. But will see. Damn pre digital age. Haven't found the air company. Might not have survived this. Give me time. Lol

Found a link on here for region maps. Going to look at that. Any surveyors on here with a file full of aerials? I know there were some on here before. Still?? Maybe not.

Mr Dave,
Another Script from the Ottawa journal that you may find VERY Interesting! .................

Plane still lost EDMONTON A search for four persons aboard a missing plane entered its fifth day today. The Cessna 185 aircraft disappeared Sunday en route from Red Deer to the Kamloops area and "SINCE THEN SEARCHERS HAVE BEEN TANTALIZED BY SIGNALS WHICH MAY HAVE COME FROM THE AIRCRAFT AND ITS PASSENGERS." Aboard were pilot Arthur Underwood and three passengers from Indian Head, Sask., Chct Talbot, 60, his wife, Betty, 47, and his, son, Sheldon, 20, who were on their way to a ranch for a Christmas holiday with their daughter. announces 1

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by GunnerySgtJackson

Mr Dave,
Another Script from the Ottawa journal that you may find VERY Interesting! .................

Plane still lost EDMONTON A search for four persons aboard a missing plane entered its fifth day today. The Cessna 185 aircraft disappeared Sunday en route from Red Deer to the Kamloops area and "SINCE THEN SEARCHERS HAVE BEEN TANTALIZED BY SIGNALS WHICH MAY HAVE COME FROM THE AIRCRAFT AND ITS PASSENGERS." Aboard were pilot Arthur Underwood and three passengers from Indian Head, Sask., Chct Talbot, 60, his wife, Betty, 47, and his, son, Sheldon, 20, who were on their way to a ranch for a Christmas holiday with their daughter. announces 1

So the information provided by the OP may have been passed on to the searchers?

[MrDave]

Originally Posted by covey ridge

So the information provided by the OP may have been passed on to the searchers?

Unfortunately it was way too late. I don't remember how many days it was after the interrogation at my school that we had them take the two way in for exami. I gained a lot of respect for my guidance councillor that day. She gave those cops an ass chewing. When one of the top students reports something like this....can say she wasn't impressed.

It took 2 days of harassing for them to pass it on. There is lots I haven't put in the forum. Stuff that people on here don't need to know. Stuff I won't share. Remember my mother also talked to the lady. It wasn't just me who got messed up from this.

[MrDave]

Originally Posted by GunnerySgtJackson

Mr Dave,
Another Script from the Ottawa journal that you may find VERY Interesting! .................

Plane still lost EDMONTON A search for four persons aboard a missing plane entered its fifth day today. The Cessna 185 aircraft disappeared Sunday en route from Red Deer to the Kamloops area and "SINCE THEN SEARCHERS HAVE BEEN TANTALIZED BY SIGNALS WHICH MAY HAVE COME FROM THE AIRCRAFT AND ITS PASSENGERS." Aboard were pilot Arthur Underwood and three passengers from Indian Head, Sask., Chct Talbot, 60, his wife, Betty, 47, and his, son, Sheldon, 20, who were on their way to a ranch for a Christmas holiday with their daughter. announces 1

Awesome find. Too bad they didn't come after the first call. How did you find this?

[Jamie]

Dave, seems like you have enough information to approach a newspaper and allow them to use thier resources.

Good luck.
Jamie

[GunnerySgtJackson]

Originally Posted by MrDave

Awesome find. Too bad they didn't come after the first call. How did you find this?

Dave,
Just wondering what your end game is, if any? Closure? Discovery of the wreck/remains? AND...
What have you done to find out more? Have you contacted RCC as suggested by another poster? They will have historical records! Did you pose any questions on avcanada forums?(I did) Have you asked your member of parliament to place the right questions to the right people....Ministerial inquireries(sp?) can really get people hopping for answers!
I've been around airplanes all my life and SAR most of my adult life and I got to tell you: There are some messed up humans out there that get off on screwing with other people. Idjits set off Red flares all the time.....Call out Maydays.....set fires to watch the pretty fire trucks go by......i know of drunks that have stolen aircraft, managed to take off then call ATC crying cause they dont know how to land.......I know of a least three aircraft that went missing and never found that were strongly suspected of not wanting to be found. Serious man, theres a lot of lunatic fringe.
The chances of an aircraft that has crashed and can not be found by an air search that would have a functioning radio/battery/antenna/range etc is pretty slim...
Im sure what happened to you was real for you as a young person but odds were you were dicked with by a lunatic/jokster and maybe the cops knew it but did not handle it well in their interaction with you.......
Looking forward to your response before I look for more info...
Ciao.

[MrDave]

U am looking but lack opportunity and time. Unlike lots of others I have a job. Lol I have no reason to doubt who I was talking to. Two days on the radio with someone kind of gives you a feel for someone. Considering that we had those radios for a few years and only heard air traffic. As for them not finding them, it was a big wilderness and the search was farther south from what I remember.
Definitely like to read the file on this. Know anyone that can go to the Libra the records are archived in?

In the end I hope to find the wreckage. I had two days of pointing my antenna that direction. Got to measure the angle I was facing so I can get an idea of where.
As for joining a forum for that I guess I could. Just don't have any time that needs wasting.

[ctd]

Oct 1978 Plane crashed 60km SW of Rocky Mountain House 2 Men Died.

Sept 1970 Plane found that had crashed 4 weeks earlier 75mile SW of Rocky Mountain House 3 Females and one Male Died in the Crash.

[MrDave]

I am left wondering about the people who told us of these all inclusive lists. The ones used to dis me. Did any of you go add to them? Lol not likely. Bad enough that you had to go to all that effort to call me a liar. Once you were proven wrong you have no more to offer? Only hoped YOU would be praised for outing me? Shameful behavior from adults.. Psychology shows us that the first to scream liar are the ones who lie themselves. "If I'm fibbing about myself, you are too". That sort of mentality.

I was talking with my day last night about this incident. He remembers the day they came and took the radio. He is still ****ed. His brother had given us the best present we ever gotten, and when it came back it was useless. The matching radio became a thing of hatred. A sign of the loss of that whole family. And to top it off, they sent me a set of cheap useless ones. We went from having top quality to having radios that would not send to the end of the property. I guess he has a reason to still be upset too.

During our chat, we started talking about the crash of another plane. It crashed on the one hill to the southwest. We used to watch the Hercules flying over following their pattern. Flying so low that we could wave to the searcher sitting at the rear on the ramp. Made me want to fly so badly .. I can say growing up in the bush country had more plusses. I miss parts of that life, others not so much.

Trying to cope with this has been tougher than I imagined. I had hoped that getting this off my back would help my soul. Will see if it gets easier. I will try to tell you some more about the second day. Patience please, I have to toughen up some before I can get it out.. This was the day she ended up alone. Tears come just thinking of her anger and loss.

[Nova]

Would them disabling the radio not have been doing you a favour? From all your accounts it seems these radios brought you endless pain and mental trauma.

[RandyBoBandy]

MrDave...I'm not trying to be a smart ***** here..BUT have you considered going to a "reader"/psychic? Give them ZERO info on your background and when asked about what you want read..say something like "my" year in whatever this happened. I know I know I'm going to get a billion of these smilies :sHa_s arcasticlol::s Ha_sarcasticlol:
Cheers

[nof60]

Originally Posted by MrLeahy

MrDave...I'm not trying to be a smart ***** here..BUT have you considered going to a "reader"/psychic? Give them ZERO info on your background and when asked about what you want read..say something like "my" year in whatever this happened. I know I know I'm going to get a billion of these smilies :sHa_s arcasticlol::s Ha_sarcasticlol:
Cheers

Sure hope your not planning on driving for the next 12 or so hours.

[RandyBoBandy]

Originally Posted by nof60

Sure hope your not planning on driving for the next 12 or so hours.

no problem with me driving gotta think outside the box sometimes

[CNP]

Originally Posted by MrLeahy

no problem with me driving gotta think outside the box sometimes

You're still in the box...

Trailer Park Boys: The Movie

After a psychic predicts his death, a small-time hoodlum named Julian hires a cheap documentary film crew to document the last few days of his mis-spent life. This is the film that pioneered the show of the same name.

[brownbomber]

Originally Posted by Nova

Would them disabling the radio not have been doing you a favour? From all your accounts it seems these radios brought you endless pain and mental trauma.

We all have different thresholds for pain and mental trauma. Some are higher some are lower. I don't see how a parent would allow a child to hear somebody in that position though, if it was that heartbreaking why let it continue?

[Weedy1]

Here's some info on the families as well as Chieftain Air Services from: http://www.townofindianhead.com/resource-links.html

http://www.ourroots.ca/e/page.aspx?id=546409
http://www.ourroots.ca/e/page.aspx?id=546196
http://www.ourroots.ca/e/page.aspx?id=546253
http://www.ourroots.ca/e/page.aspx?id=546755

[Weedy1]

[Weedy1]

***The climate data in the above post if for Red Deer BTW.***


Mr. Dave:

Some of these questions may sound stupid but could help piece this together.

Did the lady you were talking to on the radio ever indicate the following?

1) Where they took off from?

2) How long they had been in the air?

3) The surroundings of the area they crashed?

4) You said "A woman's voice came across the airwaves.
Her voice was shaking and I could hear her crying. She told us that the plane she was in had crashed. They had over flown the airport and went down."

What airport? Was it possibly the Kamloops airport as that's where they were headed?

You mentioned in the first post you thought it was the Sundre airport. Was this possibly them trying to make an emergency landing?

5) Did she give you or your folks their names?

6) Was she in contact with anyone else at the time?

7) How many times were the police contacted?

8) Were you / your folks ever in contact with the media in regards to this?

9) Were you / your folks ever in contact with the Armed Forces SAR in regards to this?

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by Weedy1

***The climate data in the above post if for Red Deer BTW.***


Mr. Dave:

Some of these questions may sound stupid but could help piece this together.

Did the lady you were talking to on the radio ever indicate the following?

1) Where they took off from?

2) How long they had been in the air?

3) The surroundings of the area they crashed?

4) You said "A woman's voice came across the airwaves.
Her voice was shaking and I could hear her crying. She told us that the plane she was in had crashed. They had over flown the airport and went down."

What airport? Was it possibly the Kamloops airport as that's where they were headed?

You mentioned in the first post you thought it was the Sundre airport. Was this possibly them trying to make an emergency landing?

5) Did she give you or your folks their names?

6) Was she in contact with anyone else at the time?

7) How many times were the police contacted?

8) Were you / your folks ever in contact with the media in regards to this?

9) Were you / your folks ever in contact with the Armed Forces SAR in regards to this?

Good questions, and good information posted in regards to the issue.

In previous posts, it appears that the aircraft was a larger commercial aircraft, however form what has since been posted, it appears that it was a smaller aircraft, and that may make it much more likely that they were not found. A small aircraft like the one the news article refers to, would not have much in the way of safety equipment, and due to it's size, would be much harder to track by ATC, and since it is smaller than suspected from earlier posts, would have been much more difficult to find if it crashed into dense woods.

Regardless, it is an interesting story, and if I was a young boy who was in contact with a survivor, I too would be haunted as Mr. Dave has.

[Weedy1]

I would also be curious to know if in fact it was the Kamloops airport that was overflown, is there is a possibility the radios being from Vancouver area / BC could have had the ability to pick up a transmission that would have otherwise not been possible if they were from the Alberta region.

ie - different crystals / frequency capabilities. Atmospheric conditions? Atmospheric bouncing?

Any radio guys on here???

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by Weedy1

I would also be curious to know if in fact it was the Kamloops airport that was overflown, is there is a possibility the radios being from Vancouver area / BC could have had the ability to pick up a transmission that would have otherwise not been possible if they were from the Alberta region.

ie - different crystals / frequency capabilities. Atmospheric conditions? Atmospheric bouncing?

Any radio guys on here???

I doubt that the radios being used would be able to pick up any communication from that distance. Most aircraft communication is VHF, and this is line of sight. 200miles under ideal conditions at altitude. In a valley on the ground, 25-50 miles depending on surrounding area.

It is possible that the aircraft had a HF radio, and this could give much longer range communication, but the radio the boys were using would most likely not have been HF. Most hand radios are VHF, FM, AM, or UHF, and not have the range to communicate with anyone from Kamloops.

[covey ridge]

Mr. Dave
I may have missed it, but did you or your mother ever ask the woman her name?

[Weedy1]

Anything further on this?
Mr Dave?

[MrDave]

I will try to cover most of the questions the best I can. Sorry for the delay, this has been really hard so I took a break from this.

The first words out of Betty's mouth was to identify herself. I couldn't remember her name, probably from all the abuse my brain went through. I know she also told my mother her name when mother introduced herself.. I don't know who she all talked to over those couple of days. We were raised to not eavesdrop on adults.
I know after this we actually spent lots of time with the Navy. You might have heard of the name, Captain Morgan. He was a close friend of my mother after this. Got to know him rather well too.

We never thought that the cops wouldn't bother to check. Why wouldn't they? I never thought that we would have to look for them ourselves. Shouldn't have happened this way. I don't remember much else about the conversation my mother had with her. I asked her what happened and she said the plane had trouble but they had tried for a airport but must have over flown it. Once again we had given space to the adults privacy.

So my search continues ..once I have more I will try to update this.

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by GunnerySgtJackson

Mr Dave,
Another Script from the Ottawa journal that you may find VERY Interesting! .................

Plane still lost EDMONTON A search for four persons aboard a missing plane entered its fifth day today. The Cessna 185 aircraft disappeared Sunday en route from Red Deer to the Kamloops area and "SINCE THEN SEARCHERS HAVE BEEN TANTALIZED BY SIGNALS WHICH MAY HAVE COME FROM THE AIRCRAFT AND ITS PASSENGERS." Aboard were pilot Arthur Underwood and three passengers from Indian Head, Sask., Chct Talbot, 60, his wife, Betty, 47, and his, son, Sheldon, 20, who were on their way to a ranch for a Christmas holiday with their daughter. announces 1

To me that says the searchers were not the ones who picked up those signals. Had that been the case, the line would read, searchers are in communication with what they believe may be the aircraft or one of the passengers.

I studied radio repair and for a time I had a radio repair shop.
Radio signals are unpredictable. VHF is called line of sight, but that does not mean it can't or won't reach a receiver that is not in the transmitters line of sight.
Range is equally unpredictable, especially at the lower VHF frequencies.


I won't go in to a in-depth discussion about frequencies and radio propagation.
I will say I believe that this story is true as presented.

I hope you find the answers you are looking for MrDave.
But I wouldn't be surprised if the plane itself is never found.

Like you, I remember a plane crash not far from home when I was young.
I remember seeing something reflecting light high on a hill south of our place and the local men believing that it was this lost airplane.

At the time we had no way of reaching the site. It was across the river from our place and no one there had a boat at the time.
A message was sent to the authorities in town but so far as I know no one ever responded and the plane was never found.