DEF Delete Kit - Duramax

[joeya]

Hi All,

I've got a 2011 2500HD Duramax, I bought it new in 2010, and also purchased extended warranty to 4 years. Warranty will be running out this year and have been thinking that I would like to get rid of all of the emmision control aspects. The main reason is that I have had issues all along with the Emmissions, mainly being the Sensors, DEF Tank losing pressure, and a couple other odd balls, frequecy is about once every 3 months. Outside of this, the truck has been great (just rolled over 100k). Since I have relativly low milage on it, I have decided to keep the truck for a couple more years, and I don't want to have to deal with the exhaust issues once it is off warranty. So my question is this, who here has done a delete kit on their 2011+ duramax? How do you like it? I'm thinking the delete, Turbo back exhaust, and maybe a tuner (is it the tuner that tricks the sesnors?)?

What type of milage gains are you seeing if any? I know I could find this out on the duramax fourums but I like you guys/gals better.

Thanks, Joey

[bhguy]

you are in a legal grey area , the def is a huge issue we are dealing with...im in the heavy/medium duty side. from what we are told at this point it is mandated and cant be removed from the vehicle due to emission standards. while it is a personal vehicle I assume, you dealer may not be able to service it in the future without it....we are awaiting more info ourselves

[Bigmountainrider]

We do DPF and Egr deletes all the time. In alberta there is no regulations for emissions ie: air care, so you can do what ever you want. Progammer is a must or the truck will shut down and go into limp mode. The programmers that handle DPF deletes are expensive compared to the others so just be aware. I like H&S for ease and gains. You may get gains upto 30% fuel economy and power. You won't be disappointed.

[buckbrushoutdoors]

Originally Posted by Bigmountainrider

We do DPF and Egr deletes all the time. In alberta there is no regulations for emissions ie: air care, so you can do what ever you want. Progammer is a must or the truck will shut down and go into limp mode. The programmers that handle DPF deletes are expensive compared to the others so just be aware. I like H&S for ease and gains. You may get gains upto 30% fuel economy and power. You won't be disappointed.

X2 what he said. Go with the h&s I went from 12 mpg to 25mpg hand calculated.

[bhguy]

Originally Posted by Bigmountainrider

We do DPF and Egr deletes all the time. In alberta there is no regulations for emissions ie: air care, so you can do what ever you want. Progammer is a must or the truck will shut down and go into limp mode. The programmers that handle DPF deletes are expensive compared to the others so just be aware. I like H&S for ease and gains. You may get gains upto 30% fuel economy and power. You won't be disappointed.

there may be for 2015, and no vehicles will be grandfathered in, we did this to a couple of our rigs (kenworth) and we are about 37% fuel savings

[greywolf]

I have a 2011 GMC Sierra 2500HD CC with the duramax. I have a dealer install done on mine, complete delete (from the turbo back, DEF, with the EGR turned off) and a H & S tuner installed. All things being equal my overall mileage gain was about 15%. This was calculated on total fuel used divided into total mileage driven;
before the delete 25,000 km and a mileage of 15.9L/100km;
after the delete, 41,000km ..and a mileage ..13.9/100km ...

With this many kilometers it eliminates the favorable data, such as driving home from Lake Louise to Red Deer (altitude drop and tailwind) and getting 10.2L/100km, or Jasper to Red Deer via hwy 93 through Nordegg, at 9.7L/100km.
It also eliminates the unfavorable data, like complete city driving in the winter were the mileage can be as high as 20L/100km.

[greywolf]

Originally Posted by buckbrushoutdoors

X2 what he said. Go with the h&s I went from 12 mpg to 25mpg hand calculated.

,

When bigmountain claimed up to 30% increase in mileage I thought that may have been a bit of a stretch (on a 2011 or newer duramax), but claims of over 100% is completely unbelievable, unless their was something seriously wrong with the tune up on the truck before the switch.
For anyone else chimeing in and making claims, lets keep it apples to apples comparisons please.

I'm saying this so people like the OP don't go out and spend $$$$ and be disappointed with the results.

[Taco]

Don't be foolin' with deletes if you want to keep your GM factory 5yr/160,000km powertrain warranty.


And as far as huge fuel economy gains...... I looked into it hard and heard some extravagant claims. Funny thing was, everyone claimed to see fuel economy gains of 10% to 30% but exactly no one would put their money where their mouth was and guarantee me a gain of half a litre per hundred kilometres. That told me everything I wanted to know.

I'm still running stone stock on my '09 D'max

[greywolf]

Originally Posted by Taco

Don't be foolin' with deletes if you want to keep your GM factory 5yr/160,000km powertrain warranty.


And as far as huge fuel economy gains...... I looked into it hard and heard some extravagant claims. Funny thing was, everyone claimed to see fuel economy gains of 10% to 30% but exactly no one would put their money where their mouth was and guarantee me a gain of half a litre per hundred kilometres. That told me everything I wanted to know.

I'm still running stone stock on my '09 D'max

I'll put my money where my mouth is.
P.S.... Elimination of the regen itself accounts for approx 5% gain in economy and the other 10% would be from the H & S tuner... in my case.

[Bigmountainrider]

This is how it works, think of you engine like an athlete. You can run further in cooler climates because the cool air you breathe in helps to cool you. This is as simple as I can explain an EGR delete. Again as a athlete, think of someone holding a hand over your mouth when you exhale, remove the hand and you use less energy to run. This is as simply as I can descibe an DPF delete. Horsepower and fuel economy are lost to these items in this way. Zero emmissions out the tailpipe but a lot more fossil fuels in the gas tank. Its a trade off.

[Rockyman41]

I just thought I'd throw in here. The shop I work at does a pile of deletes. I've never had a customer come back complaining about mileage ever. Most guys see at least 5mpg. There's lots that get better than that too.

It's also much better on your engine too. Shutting off the regen and the egr keeps dirty exhaust and extra fuel out of the engine and out of the oil as well. I can clearly see the difference in oil at change intervals.

That said, it isn't legal in some states and provinces and you can be ticketed and towed. It also most certainly will void your warranty. Some guys get away with having the pipe put back in and stock programming before a dealer visit but if they look hard enough they'll figure it out.

[greywolf]

Originally Posted by Bigmountainrider

This is how it works, think of you engine like an athlete. You can run further in cooler climates because the cool air you breathe in helps to cool you. This is as simple as I can explain an EGR delete. Again as a athlete, think of someone holding a hand over your mouth when you exhale, remove the hand and you use less energy to run. This is as simply as I can descibe an DPF delete. Horsepower and fuel economy are lost to these items in this way. Zero emmissions out the tailpipe but a lot more fossil fuels in the gas tank. Its a trade off.

I agree with what your saying here, keep in mind (IMO) that a vehicle does not require much energy to travel down the highway at 110 km/hr. (How much air in and exhaust out is there travelling down the highway at 1500 rpm and the throttle barely tipped in, in this case the athlete is walking))? If it was lots, then they would not get upwards of 25 MPG stock.
OTOH the above does more for the engine (power wise) under heavy acceleration where it needs to draw in as much air as possible, then exhaust it.(In this case the athlete is running)!!

Isn't some of the gains in mileage achieved more through fuel timing???

[greywolf]

Back to Joey's original post;
Yes you can go to some of the diesel forums but you will find a wide variation of claims for sure.
For some reason when inquiring about mileage and reading the responses, somebody always does better, the longer the post the worse it gets.

[Taco]

Originally Posted by greywolf

I'll put my money where my mouth is.
P.S.... Elimination of the regen itself accounts for approx 5% gain in economy and the other 10% would be from the H & S tuner... in my case.

Your case maybe... my conditions? Forgetaboutit..

[KBF]

DPF and DEF (SCR)are not the same thing,correct?

[Rockyman41]

Originally Posted by KBF

DPF and DEF are not the same thing,correct?

No. Not the same. Dpf is the diesel particulate filter and def is diesel exhaust fluid. Some trucks have both and some just have the dpf. They both get deleted by the programmer.

[lilsundance]

One thing everyone forgets about. That's, in most cases, your truck won't be accepted as a trade in with out the egr,dpf etc on it. I know a lot on here are gonna say BS to that but a truck that's been physically altered from meeting the emissions of the year made will cost the dealer piles to get it back to spec. If they accept it as a trade in then you can bet you will get a whole heck of a lot less for it as they can't sell it like that. Its illegal for a dealer to sell it from what I have been told.

[Smokinyotes]

So if I do exhaust and programmer on my 2011 Dmax it will delete the dpf,def and shut off the egr and improve my mileage??? What does it cost?

[bhguy]

Originally Posted by lilsundance

One thing everyone forgets about. That's, in most cases, your truck won't be accepted as a trade in with out the egr,dpf etc on it. I know a lot on here are gonna say BS to that but a truck that's been physically altered from meeting the emissions of the year made will cost the dealer piles to get it back to spec. If they accept it as a trade in then you can bet you will get a whole heck of a lot less for it as they can't sell it like that. Its illegal for a dealer to sell it from what I have been told.

Your bang on, I can only talk about large trucks. I took one off a first Gen kenworth,it was up north and freezing up all the time. We went to trade in and they said no way. I ended up having to reinstall all the parts and trade to a different dealer.

[BuckMaster101]

My buddy runs a dealership and takes them on trade all the time, if there was legal ramifications he wouldn't. At least 1/2 the truck in the patch have this done in some form. Just drive buy a dealerships used lot and check out the lifted trucks, I bet they have it done. The dealers are having a hard time though, they are getting pressured to quit installing them.

[sako1]

Originally Posted by Smokinyotes

So if I do exhaust and programmer on my 2011 Dmax it will delete the dpf,def and shut off the egr and improve my mileage??? What does it cost?

Yup.Just did a 2012 yesterday.Exhaust and programmer.The programmer deleted all emission sensors,egr and def.I yanked that stupid def tank out along with any other related crap.You should see the pile of garbage on the floor when im done.Truck sounded great and had a ton more power.I think it was about $2500 out the door.If your handy at all you can do it WAY cheaper yourself.

[bhguy]

Originally Posted by BuckMaster101

My buddy runs a dealership and takes them on trade all the time, if there was legal ramifications he wouldn't. At least 1/2 the truck in the patch have this done in some form. Just drive buy a dealerships used lot and check out the lifted trucks, I bet they have it done. The dealers are having a hard time though, they are getting pressured to quit installing them.

Ask your buddy what he would do for a trade in value, or if he would at all? Just curious

[Bushmonkey]

I did EGR, DPF deletes. Programmer and exhaust.


In the summer I got about 100 more km's per fill up. I fill up when the gas light comes on. On my truck takes about 75 litres to fill up from when the light comes on.

In the winter I don't get that 100 extra km's though.

I really see miliage gains when towing/hauling.

If your keeping your truck for a long long time like me, its worth it to do the mod's when its off warranty.

[BuckMaster101]

I'll see what he says, Probably have to be in the morning.

As a side note I'm talking about 3/4 and one tons. I don't know about big rigs.

[a little redneck]

You'll save $1,000 - $1,250 doing it yourself. Worst part is taking off the old exhaust.... it'll also take a couple of days to tear everything off and install the plates and exhaust.

I get an extra 200 km on a 125 l tank... this was on a 2000 km trip driving across Alberta and Saskatchewan and back, hand calculated 13.9 l/100km. In the city it is around 100-150 km more on a tank than before.

Word of caution.... some of the extra power is from the tuner eliminating torque reduction from the factory settings... this translates into transmission problems if you're abusive with the extra power. I've had zero problems with the new system and no visible smoke while towing or driving.

Dodge wanted $1,000 to remove and clean the egr cooler.... made the switch a no-brainer.

[32-40win]

A lot of people are doing it once the units are off warranty,but, the one thing I tell them when asked about it, is---if you take it off, keep ALL of the old parts. Alberta is likely going to do something about it, in the next year or so, they are looking at it, as we have been told. I can't blame a person for doing it, but, sooner or later, the gov't will do something about it, and it won't be a pretty scenario.

[bhguy]

Originally Posted by BuckMaster101

I'll see what he says, Probably have to be in the morning.

As a side note I'm talking about 3/4 and one tons. I don't know about big rigs.

I know, the pending changes will be for all vehicles, it is a change to the emissions, that's all that the tree huggers care about...until then keep rollin coal !

[Bigmountainrider]

Originally Posted by bhguy

Ask your buddy what he would do for a trade in value, or if he would at all? Just curious

Why are you trying to trade in? Your truck is worth thousands more on a private sale. Reme,ber that a guy has to pay a low enough price on a trade in that he can do required repairs, mark it up, and then resale it.

[joeya]

Thanks guys, I spoke with the GM dealer and they are going to do it for me, and chaper than the diesel performance shop in the city with the same parts.

[greywolf]

joey,
tell us more about the set up.
FYI;
Mine is a 2011 duramax;
DEF/DPF delete,
new exhaust system from the turbo back including a free flowing flo pro muffler, all 4",
EGR disconnected,
DEF tank removed,
H&S tuner (old version) XRT PRO, with 4 settings, stock, mild, wild, and hot. I have mine on the third setting (wild), ,
$1800 + GST 19 months ago, GM dealer.