Almost a daily occurance

tim1 · #1 11-12-2015, 07:17 PM

Every time someone has difficulty gaining access they post it here. I have deceided to do the same only this is the other side of the coin. Every time someone trespasses or breaks access rules it will be posted. Tonight I catch to guys driving in a prairie trail on DEEDED land without permission. They give me the same excuse that I have heard a thousand times, I thought I was on such and such grazing reserve. Grab a map and a f-ing brain you half wits! I also wonder what gives them the right to drive around making ruts after 6 inches of wet snow and rain prior to the snow on the prairie even if it was a grazing reserve? These two have been told to never come to this ranch again as they are noe denied access for life. This is how I will handle people who are caught breaking simple rules. Fish and wildlife and the RCMP don't want to see this as a huge problem to landowners so we will deal with it ourselves.

gitrdun · #2 11-12-2015, 07:28 PM

I totally commiserate with you Tim. With today's available technology there is no excuse for not knowing where you'really at. I'm not a land baron myself on my mere 5 acres, but my friends and neighbour's are. And I know that they deal with the same BS as you do. And like yourself, they shut her down for some and leave it open for the few respectful hunters.

7mmremmag · #3 11-12-2015, 07:45 PM

Amen, had a guy in a company vehicle with Guest Controls written all over the side of it drive right out into a posted field, only to get within 300yds of my blind I was sitting in and slam the brakes on and make a break for it. Too bad he was caught by the land owner.
I sure feel like calling the manager of Guest Controls in Lloydminster and asking him to have a chat with his guys about this kinda crap. Especially in a company vehicle, how dumb do you have to be???

Cottus · #4 11-12-2015, 07:46 PM

Tim1 that is absolutely fair play. Me and a buddy go hunting - and we're pretty normal guys - we've got 4-5 GPS enabled devices, plus backroads mapbooks, plus WMU maps, plus hunting apps, plus compasses...we know where we are. If you're not *sure* where you are just don't go. It's pretty easy.

Lefty-Canuck · #5 11-12-2015, 07:49 PM

Agree Tim. I have pictures of people driving a Razor on posted land...I have both license plate and frontal pictures of the occupants. They are going to realize they can't just go somewhere because the Razor will take them there.

LC

Jeromeo · #6 11-12-2015, 08:03 PM

Sorry to hear. I've had some yahoos come in and steal my trail camera off of our 1/4 section. Just recently we had someone knock down our second gate that lead onto a trail on our land. I found the gate buried in snow along with the "No Tresspassing" sign.

As for us granting permission, definitely not happening. Simply because you can't trust anyone and there is more than enough hunting pressure from my brother and I.

Kurt505 · #7 11-12-2015, 08:07 PM

The way I see it, private land, no permission asked for or granted, you're totally in bounds if you have them charged with trespassing.

A friend of mine crossed my neighbors land without asking permission then shot a deer on the crown land adjacent to it. My neighbor called me up and asked what he should do. Although my neighbor and I have an agreement that he can shoot on my land and vise versa, it doesn't extend to others that we know. I told him that I would be upset if one of his buddies wrecked my hunt and cut across my land without asking and told him to do whatever he felt he had to do. Friend or not, doesn't mean respect is optional.

Lease land is a different story.

tim1 · #8 11-12-2015, 08:18 PM

What do you imply by lease land is a different story. Does this mean if it is lease land they should drive where they want cutting ruts and causing damage?

deerguy · #9 11-12-2015, 08:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tim1

What do you imply by lease land is a different story. Does this mean if it is lease land they should drive where they want cutting ruts and causing damage?

He means on lease land if they walk on there is nothing you can do.

tim1 · #10 11-12-2015, 08:28 PM

Are we going here again? Get the regulations on lease land right. You still need permission to access lease land. Access can be denied for numerous reasons. I just love how some of you are lease land experts.

hal53 · #11 11-12-2015, 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tim1

Are we going here again? Get the regulations on lease land right. You still need permission to access lease land. Access can be denied for numerous reasons. I just love how some of you are lease land experts.

pretty sad.... only took 8 posts to turn a good thread around......

hardy · #12 11-12-2015, 08:35 PM

It says contact lease holder first. Then follows that a lease holder must allow reasonable access.

Dewey Cox · #13 11-12-2015, 08:46 PM

I was thinking of a change of scenery for this weekend's hunt.
I texted a guy tonight to see if I could hunt a few of his quarters, and he said sure.
I don't really get how so many people have such a hard time finding hunting land. Alberta's a big place. Trouble in one spot? Find another. Hunt somewhere new. It's a good time.

tim1 · #14 11-12-2015, 09:00 PM

You guys need to realize what reasonable access is. I am not going through this BS again. I am sick of the round and round. Quotes from people such as AFGA president Wayne Lowry regarding permission to Alberta lease land are going to be met with very strong opposition from lease holders because what the AFGA and Alberta hunters and recreational users are asking for from the provincial government are unreasonable. Lowry is claiming crown land is a publicly owned asset. When the public does damage to said asset, who is there to pick up the pieces? It is in fact the leaseholder, 24/7, 365 days a year. Not just during hunting season.

Deer Hunter · #15 11-12-2015, 09:07 PM

That's an unfortunate occurance alright.

On the other hand, we really need to ensure that public lands and grazing leases remain provincial property, and don't get sold to the highest bidder. Access is a bitch, and it appears like it's getting harder.

TBark · #16 11-12-2015, 09:08 PM

How much damage can foot traffic do really Q.
Sure some bad apples driving against access plan but geesh.
And these said, numerous reasons to deny entry..
People will give notice to enter, and likely not see the several other hunters or cattle that are said to be there.
Too bad some ruin it for others, and Im speaking of both hunters and lease holders.

TBark

gitrdun · #17 11-12-2015, 09:13 PM

Tim, I don't know why you have such issues with a certain part of access. Do remember that it is "Crown Land". My neighbour is much in the same situation as you are. But with proper management, they have no problems whatsoever. Maybe you should talk to me as to how to proceed as I have been able to subdue issues between the lease holder and those that want to hunt it. I'm not pretending to be a know it all or arbitrator in this aspect, but I have been able to suggest alternatives that were beneficial both ways.

tim1 · #18 11-12-2015, 09:19 PM

gitrdun, I would like you to pm me sometime. I am curious about several things you have put in your post. I would be happy to have a civil conversation with you about issues on both sides.

Kurt505 · #19 11-12-2015, 09:43 PM

Access to lease land has to be granted if all rules of the lease agreement are followed. If Tim, or anyone would like a copy of the rules outlined by the provincial government you can pm me and I will forward a copy of the email I received from the government earlier this year while I was researching the subject. I have also been advised by both the ministry of environment and parks, and fish and wildlife that if all rules of the lease are being followed and access is still denied, to contact the lands officer. I have the names of two such officers for the counties I hunt. Having just a couple cattle, or couple horses is not grounds to deny access, as some lease holders would like you to believe. If you own the land you have all the rights in the world to deny access to anyone, that's what I meant by leases are a different story, not that people can drive all over the place if they want. Sheesh.

gitrdun · #20 11-12-2015, 10:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tim1

gitrdun, I would like you to pm me sometime. I am curious about several things you have put in your post. I would be happy to have a civil conversation with you about issues on both sides.

You can PM me anytime you wish Tim. I can give you my phone number or I would be happy to discuss this with you over coffee, tea or whatever. I'd welcome this conversation.

Redfrog · #21 11-12-2015, 11:17 PM

There is no shortage of people disrespecting the property of others. It can be very frustrating until you catch them.

I have trouble understanding why a rancher that thinks access or managing the grazing lease is such a PITA, would continue to lease it. Just turn it back over to the gov't.

HowSwedeItIs · #22 11-12-2015, 11:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tim1

You guys need to realize what reasonable access is. I am not going through this BS again. I am sick of the round and round. Quotes from people such as AFGA president Wayne Lowry regarding permission to Alberta lease land are going to be met with very strong opposition from lease holders because what the AFGA and Alberta hunters and recreational users are asking for from the provincial government are unreasonable. Lowry is claiming crown land is a publicly owned asset. When the public does damage to said asset, who is there to pick up the pieces? It is in fact the leaseholder, 24/7, 365 days a year. Not just during hunting season.

Not this spiel again, you and all the other leaseholders on this forum take heed- because you only hold the damn lease

You don't own the land, you maintain it at 'your expense' because you're profiting off of it by having your cattle graze there. You don't have special rights apart from mandating foot access only, and you have been told that time and time again by various authorities. You're fricken lucky to have the use of the area to graze your animals, you could be getting your farm life jollies on a little hobby ranch outside vegreville. Think about that the next time I give you notice I'll be on our land

huntwat · #23 11-12-2015, 11:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tim1

You guys need to realize what reasonable access is. I am not going through this BS again. I am sick of the round and round. Quotes from people such as AFGA president Wayne Lowry regarding permission to Alberta lease land are going to be met with very strong opposition from lease holders because what the AFGA and Alberta hunters and recreational users are asking for from the provincial government are unreasonable. Lowry is claiming crown land is a publicly owned asset. When the public does damage to said asset, who is there to pick up the pieces? It is in fact the leaseholder, 24/7, 365 days a year. Not just during hunting season.

I wonder who chooses to make money off the lease land 24/7 365 days of the year??? I wonder if they would allow someone else to take over the lease because there are too many headaches??? Effin lease holders that think they own the land.

dannypee · #24 11-12-2015, 11:58 PM

Another thread bites the dust

hal53 · #25 11-13-2015, 06:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dannypee

Another thread bites the dust

Yup, pretty easy to see why some people can't get permission on deeded land, very sad to see the attitude of some people...

chad66 · #26 11-13-2015, 06:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hal53

Yup, pretty easy to see why some people can't get permission on deeded land, very sad to see the attitude of some people...

On both sides of the fence...

tim1 · #27 11-13-2015, 07:24 AM

Thank you to the intelligent people who post reasonable comments on this forum. These are the ones who have no problem accessing leased or deeded lands so they can enjoy the land along with the rest of us in a respectful manner. When these people ask for permission they are easy to pick out. The other clowns are easier. Like someone has posted, no wonder they have trouble with access.

martinnordegg · #28 11-13-2015, 07:29 AM

This year we have had more trouble with trespassers than ever. Neighbors concur. Probably the price of store bought meat/the economy/jobs lost etc..

I have been pretty civil with the first batch but not any more. F&W are so busy with more serious problems to even bother with trespassing and the RCMP are in the same boat.

I'm going to the next level of my "education" program.

Edit: I am referring to deeded land.

elkhunter11 · #29 11-13-2015, 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hal53

Yup, pretty easy to see why some people can't get permission on deeded land, very sad to see the attitude of some people...

Way too many "entitled" people.

Brandon5555 · #30 11-13-2015, 08:04 AM

A little off topic but relevant all the same. Fishing on deeded land with creek bed rights. A couple months back parked up the road from jumping pound creek, hadn't even unpacked my gear yet, or made it to the fence for that matter
And sure enough some old guy in a black f150 wasted no time howling up to my truck telling me not even to think about fishing the creek as he owns the creek bed in the deed. Honestly tell me what is some fat guy in chest waders gonna do to your precious creek bed? I always respect the land and the property of others, as I told him but got bounced out regardless. Ain't right.